| CURRENT EVENTS Brittney Griner in Exchange for an Arms Dealer

BAMAneck said:
Let me preface this by saying , I’m not above burning one if I’m on vacation or out canoeing or something but to swap a High value prisoner for an American hatin pot head. Just don’t seem right . If I were negotiating the trade , it would have been for the Marine. Brittney would have been the deal sealer for them to get the American killing arms dealer back. Another example of this administration weak ass decision making on display. Afghanistan comes to mind , when he left people behind. Embarrassing!

While there are thousands in jail in this country for the exact same charge and rightly charged because of Laws.

But she somehow was wrongly charged even though they have laws against what she did .
Click to expand...
She may not like your version of America
 
ElephantStomp said:
She may not like your version of America
Click to expand...

You point at something that is very apparent in the United States. There are currently two visions of what America is as a country as of 2022:

1. The traditional view. America was built by European settlers who would ultimately form a new nation that was both very similar and different than their European homeland. Through hard work and commitment the United States became a super power.

2. The revisionist view. America was a country built by White patriarchs who oppressed women and various other races/groups of people to make the United States a super power. For them, America was a prosperous country to live in, but that prosperity was exclusive to mostly them alone.

I would argue that vision #2 is the consensus within our current ruling institutions. The problem with vision #2 is that it offers no positive vision for what a country should be. It's simply an oppression Olympics between various groups of people vying for who got shafted the hardest. The only thing that unifies those who believe in vision #2 is utter contempt for White males and any traditional values that have been passed on throughout the generations. And by traditional values, I do not just mean cultural norms that are very prevalent in White culture. This line of thinking leads to eradicating gender differences in languages such as Spanish (IE Latinx instead of Latino/Latina). This line of thinking leads to emasculating men of all races and creeds.

Vision #1 is no longer applicable in the United States. This nation has undergone so much demographic and cultural change that it would be impossible for the millions of different types of people to embrace it. And quite frankly, why would they embrace it? Indians (not Native Americans) come to the United States because of an H1B Visa and an opportunity to work as some IT specialist in Silicon Valley. They could probably care less about America's traditions or history. The same could be said about poor Latin Americans who enter through the Southern border. To them, working as a dishwasher at Applebee's is better than living in Mexico.

Ultimately, I believe that these two visions are dialectally incompatible with one another. I think it would be best for the different regions of the United States to cut their ties with one another and go their own way. Divorces are ugly and have profound collateral damage on families, but sometimes they are a necessity when the two parents hate each other to the point of violence. Lets not let affairs get to this point. Because if they do, I believe you could possibly see the types of grotesque acts that occurred during the collapse of Yugoslavia in the 1990s.
 
ElephantStomp said:
Generally I would think getting any American back would be welcomed, but I’m learning that no matter what this administration does people on a certain side will still bitch
Click to expand...
This administration wants to deny Americans their Constitutional gun rights and ban as many guns as they can while releasing a person who sold much more dangerous weapons to the highest bidder no matter who they were in order to look good to the media. While I am glad she was released, it is stupid to believe that this trade was not terrible. Biden capitulated to Russia for PR purposes and released someone who will arm people who attack the US and our allies.
 
Star High School player , Star college player , Top pick in WNBA draft , WNBA star , openly gay without persecution.

If anyone should love America it’s her.

If she lived in any Islamic countries she’d be none of those. Think Communist / Socialist countries she’d have the same opportunities ? No , they all come here. Why is that ?

I guess when your country has been so successful living of our grandparents hard work and discovery we’ve become lazy . Lovers of ourselves.

I don’t dislike her. I watched her at Baylor dominate. She’s no Candice Parker but she was legit. I don’t watch pro ball anymore since they stopped allowing them to play defense. And I’ve never really watched the women’s pro game. But I just don’t like the disrespect for the place that created just for that if you have the drive to take it. But she broke the law. Ever heard of Baretta ?

The Constitution and the Bill of Rights are two of the greatest documents to exist. They allows for changes to correct wrongs . They give me and you rights that until recently was only found here.

Yea It was wrote by less than perfect people , but they were the people that had that idea of freedom and we’re willing to fight for it. We should all aspire to those ideas .

Ever wonder why the rear view mirror is so small and the windshield so large ?
 
Last edited:
I do get very tired of the "X Hates America" BS. Griner has a ton of faults, but her argument was that the National Anthem doesn't belong anymore because it was written when blacks did not have rights and slavery was still legal in most of the US. She didn't kneel, she just stayed off the court while it was being played. You know, what some said the NFL players should do. She is entitled to that opinion and that argument shouldn't just be ignored even if you think it is wrong. But some can't even argue a point so they just have to start the Griner Hates America garbage. And I say that as someone who doesn't like her and can come up with way better reasons.
 
TideatMileHigh said:
You point at something that is very apparent in the United States. There are currently two visions of what America is as a country as of 2022:

1. The traditional view. America was built by European settlers who would ultimately form a new nation that was both very similar and different than their European homeland. Through hard work and commitment the United States became a super power.

2. The revisionist view. America was a country built by White patriarchs who oppressed women and various other races/groups of people to make the United States a super power. For them, America was a prosperous country to live in, but that prosperity was exclusive to mostly them alone.

I would argue that vision #2 is the consensus within our current ruling institutions. The problem with vision #2 is that it offers no positive vision for what a country should be. It's simply an oppression Olympics between various groups of people vying for who got shafted the hardest. The only thing that unifies those who believe in vision #2 is utter contempt for White males and any traditional values that have been passed on throughout the generations. And by traditional values, I do not just mean cultural norms that are very prevalent in White culture. This line of thinking leads to eradicating gender differences in languages such as Spanish (IE Latinx instead of Latino/Latina). This line of thinking leads to emasculating men of all races and creeds.

Vision #1 is no longer applicable in the United States. This nation has undergone so much demographic and cultural change that it would be impossible for the millions of different types of people to embrace it. And quite frankly, why would they embrace it? Indians (not Native Americans) come to the United States because of an H1B Visa and an opportunity to work as some IT specialist in Silicon Valley. They could probably care less about America's traditions or history. The same could be said about poor Latin Americans who enter through the Southern border. To them, working as a dishwasher at Applebee's is better than living in Mexico.

Ultimately, I believe that these two visions are dialectally incompatible with one another. I think it would be best for the different regions of the United States to cut their ties with one another and go their own way. Divorces are ugly and have profound collateral damage on families, but sometimes they are a necessity when the two parents hate each other to the point of violence. Lets not let affairs get to this point. Because if they do, I believe you could possibly see the types of grotesque acts that occurred during the collapse of Yugoslavia in the 1990s.
Click to expand...
There’s a lot to unpack in your statement. I completely disagree with damn near everything you said. I don’t believe in your dark days, America is falling, civil war mindset.

Your #1 and #2 thing I’m not going to get into because when you believe one side is superior than the other there’s no middle ground and no logical way to have a discussion. But, I will say if you don’t believe that for a very long time this country was only prosperous for white males and that it was racist and misogynistic then there’s absolutely no hope for any discussion
 
rocknthefreeworld said:
This administration wants to deny Americans their Constitutional gun rights and ban as many guns as they can while releasing a person who sold much more dangerous weapons to the highest bidder no matter who they were in order to look good to the media. While I am glad she was released, it is stupid to believe that this trade was not terrible. Biden capitulated to Russia for PR purposes and released someone who will arm people who attack the US and our allies.
Click to expand...
I go back to my statement from earlier that no matter what this administration does people will still bitch. Any time an American can come home is a reason to celebrate irregardless of the price.
 
ElephantStomp said:
There’s a lot to unpack in your statement. I completely disagree with damn near everything you said. I don’t believe in your dark days, America is falling, civil war mindset.

Your #1 and #2 thing I’m not going to get into because when you believe one side is superior than the other there’s no middle ground and no logical way to have a discussion. But, I will say if you don’t believe that for a very long time this country was only prosperous for white males and that it was racist and misogynistic then there’s absolutely no hope for any discussion
Click to expand...
"I don’t believe in your dark days, America is falling, civil war mindset."

Countries and empires don't last forever, why wouldn't the same be true for the United States? I don't see a healthy society in the United States as of 2022, I see a deeply polarized nation. Divorce rates are through the roof; people aren't having kids because of the cost of living; the middle class is becoming smaller and smaller every year; people are hooked on/addicted to SSRIs, opioids, alcohol and other drugs; younger Americans are suffocated with student loans (and this includes people with technical degrees in engineering, IT, medical studies, and accounting); our inner cities are so damn violent, it would require a paramilitary force to bring order; millions no longer trust election results (and this includes liberals as well as indicated by Russia Gate); There is a fair amount of cultural animosity between different races etc. And the list goes on and on. Do you think this is sustainable? These are issues that have been brewing for decades, and it is very likely that these issues will ultimately contribute to this nation's undoing sometime in this century.

Also, "Civil War" is the worst case scenario. A more likely scenario, is what happened when the Soviet Union collapsed in 1991.

"But, I will say if you don’t believe that for a very long time this country was only prosperous for white males and that it was racist and misogynistic then there’s absolutely no hope for any discussion"

So let me ask you this: What can be done? Acknowledge that slavery and Jim Crow happened? Well that has already occurred. I started public school in the late 90s/early 2000s, and I can tell you right now that every year you learn about the Civil War and MLK.

"then there’s absolutely no hope for any discussion"

My friend, that was the thesis of my initial response. There is no hope for any discussion. Those two conflicting visions cannot be reconciled in this country. I cannot think of any scenario that could cause this country to become united.
 
TideatMileHigh said:
You point at something that is very apparent in the United States. There are currently two visions of what America is as a country as of 2022:

1. The traditional view. America was built by European settlers who would ultimately form a new nation that was both very similar and different than their European homeland. Through hard work and commitment the United States became a super power.

2. The revisionist view. America was a country built by White patriarchs who oppressed women and various other races/groups of people to make the United States a super power. For them, America was a prosperous country to live in, but that prosperity was exclusive to mostly them alone.

I would argue that vision #2 is the consensus within our current ruling institutions. The problem with vision #2 is that it offers no positive vision for what a country should be. It's simply an oppression Olympics between various groups of people vying for who got shafted the hardest. The only thing that unifies those who believe in vision #2 is utter contempt for White males and any traditional values that have been passed on throughout the generations. And by traditional values, I do not just mean cultural norms that are very prevalent in White culture. This line of thinking leads to eradicating gender differences in languages such as Spanish (IE Latinx instead of Latino/Latina). This line of thinking leads to emasculating men of all races and creeds.

Vision #1 is no longer applicable in the United States. This nation has undergone so much demographic and cultural change that it would be impossible for the millions of different types of people to embrace it. And quite frankly, why would they embrace it? Indians (not Native Americans) come to the United States because of an H1B Visa and an opportunity to work as some IT specialist in Silicon Valley. They could probably care less about America's traditions or history. The same could be said about poor Latin Americans who enter through the Southern border. To them, working as a dishwasher at Applebee's is better than living in Mexico.

Ultimately, I believe that these two visions are dialectally incompatible with one another. I think it would be best for the different regions of the United States to cut their ties with one another and go their own way. Divorces are ugly and have profound collateral damage on families, but sometimes they are a necessity when the two parents hate each other to the point of violence. Lets not let affairs get to this point. Because if they do, I believe you could possibly see the types of grotesque acts that occurred during the collapse of Yugoslavia in the 1990s.
Click to expand...

ElephantStomp said:
There’s a lot to unpack in your statement. I completely disagree with damn near everything you said. I don’t believe in your dark days, America is falling, civil war mindset.

Your #1 and #2 thing I’m not going to get into because when you believe one side is superior than the other there’s no middle ground and no logical way to have a discussion. But, I will say if you don’t believe that for a very long time this country was only prosperous for white males and that it was racist and misogynistic then there’s absolutely no hope for any discussion
Click to expand...

Guys, I'm not looking to enter into a point/counterpoint on this, but I did quote your two posts.

@TideatMileHigh , I agree with much of what you said, but I would like to offer that American remains a melting pot. Over the life of our country, many have expressed fear that the...Irish, Italians, Chinese, Polish, Puerto Ricans, Cubans, Mexicans, Hondurans, Indians, etc....would ruin the country by not assimilating. It's not happened. I would encourage anyone who has a jaded view of those pursuing a spot in this country to watch this documentary, I think the youtube link is free. The author/producer's husband became a citizen, and that gave them the idea to attend a naturalization ceremony in every state. It's hard not to feel proud about our country when others are so grateful to be here and be a part of it.

Citizen USA A 50 State Road Trip​




@ElephantStomp one of the biggest faults with the cancellation of historical figures is holding them to the same standards of conscience that exist today. When we (or at least me) see parents today letting their kids bounce around in a car instead of in a car seat or seat belt, I think of how dangerous and illegal it is. Growing up fifty years ago, it was commonplace, I'm lucky I never went flying through a windshield. Whether it is slavery, racism, sexism, monopolies, anti-homosexual stances - the list is endless - you can't view history through the prism of today's prevailing social positions, unless you're simply asserting that they were all evil. The Founding Fathers created a wonderful country that people throng to, and they've sought it from the time it was formed imperfectly, through every era of incivility and unfairness, and they still seek it today.

God bless our nation. Long may it remain united.

EDIT - Divorce rate is at a fifty-year low. The U.S. Divorce Rate Has Hit a 50-Year Low I do agree with what the scourge of drug addiction is doing to our nation.

RTR,

Tim
 
Last edited:
It Takes Eleven said:
Guys, I'm not looking to enter into a point/counterpoint on this, but I did quote your two posts.

@TideatMileHigh , I agree with much of what you said, but I would like to offer that American remains a melting pot. Over the life of our country, many have expressed fear that the...Irish, Italians, Chinese, Polish, Puerto Ricans, Cubans, Mexicans, Hondurans, Indians, etc....would ruin the country by not assimilating. It's not happened. I would encourage anyone who has a jaded view of those pursuing a spot in this country to watch this documentary, I think the youtube link is free. The author/producer's husband became a citizen, and that gave them the idea to attend a naturalization ceremony in every state. It's hard not to feel proud about our country when others are so grateful to be here and be a part of it.

Citizen USA A 50 State Road Trip​




@ElephantStomp one of the biggest faults with the cancellation of historical figures is holding them to the same standards of conscience that exist today. When we (or at least me) see parents today letting their kids bounce around in a car instead of in a car seat or seat belt, I think of how dangerous and illegal it is. Growing up fifty years ago, it was commonplace, I'm lucky I never went flying through a windshield. Whether it is slavery, racism, sexism, monopolies, anti-homosexual stances - the list is endless - you can't view history through the prism of today's prevailing social positions, unless you're simply asserting that they were all evil. The Founding Fathers created a wonderful country that people throng to, and they've sought it from the time it was formed imperfectly, through every era of incivility and unfairness, and they still seek it today.

God bless our nation. Long may it remain united.

EDIT - Divorce rate is at a fifty-year low. The U.S. Divorce Rate Has Hit a 50-Year Low I do agree with what the scourge of drug addiction is doing to our nation.

RTR,

Tim
Click to expand...


I do not think you can compare immigration in the 1800s/early 1900s to what we are seeing today. Annual net immigration into the United States every year is in the range of hundreds of thousands, if not well over one million persons per year. This is astronomical in size compared to quotas that was in previous immigration legislation such as the Naturalization Act of 1924. This huge amount of immigration has had a profound effect on the United States. You can argue that the effects are good, but you also have to acknowledge the costs it has had on the country. These effects are environmental, political, economical, and social in nature.

Up until the Hart Celler Act of 1965 was passed, immigration into the United States was allowed only from the European continent (outside from Chinese laborers being let in during the mid 1800s). Early US politicians may have viewed the US as a "melting pot", but it was a melting pot for only European diaspora (See Naturalization Act of 1790 & Immigration Act of 1924). And even with allowable immigration from the European continent as a whole, legislation such as the Immigration Act of 1924 placed strict quotas on immigrants from Southern/Eastern European countries.

The idea that America was always this beautiful melting pot where people from all around the world came together, sang Bob Dillon, and grilled ribs is a disingenuous lie promoted by insidious actors or wishful thinking types. I hate to say it, but the main types of people who seriously buy into the "melting pot" theory are Baby Boomers and insulated White liberals like my cousin in Northern Virginia.
 
ElephantStomp said:
Only reason she was held to begin with is because she was well known
Click to expand...
This comment stuck with me yesterday—"well known?"

A few things were shared when my friends and I were talking about this yesterday. I asked the group (five) how many WNBA teams they could name: no one had more than a couple.

I wonder if I knew who she was before she was arrested. I'm sure I had heard her name, but she definitely wasn't well known. Four of the six didn't know who she was before the arrest.

I saw mention that the number of people who attended WNBA games last season—every team, every game—and there was only a few thousand fans differential between their entire season and the number of fans who attended football games at UA.

Looking back I have to disagree. She wasn't well known. It's a league that's not popular—the Vanderbilt of professional leagues.

On the other hand she became well known after the arrest. It leaves us with the question, "why did she become well known after the arrest?"

The charge?
Her sexual orientation?
Her race?

I believe all three apply with the charge resonating the least among the public.
 
ElephantStomp said:
I go back to my statement from earlier that no matter what this administration does people will still bitch. Any time an American can come home is a reason to celebrate irregardless of the price.
Click to expand...
We will have to agree to disagree. Were this a Republican or Libertarian President doing this trade I would feel the same. It has nothing to do with it being Biden. You make a lot of assumptions and blanket statements.
 
TerryP said:
This comment stuck with me yesterday—"well known?"

A few things were shared when my friends and I were talking about this yesterday. I asked the group (five) how many WNBA teams they could name: no one had more than a couple.

I wonder if I knew who she was before she was arrested. I'm sure I had heard her name, but she definitely wasn't well known. Four of the six didn't know who she was before the arrest.

I saw mention that the number of people who attended WNBA games last season—every team, every game—and there was only a few thousand fans differential between their entire season and the number of fans who attended football games at UA.

Looking back I have to disagree. She wasn't well known. It's a league that's not popular—the Vanderbilt of professional leagues.

On the other hand she became well known after the arrest. It leaves us with the question, "why did she become well known after the arrest?"

The charge?
Her sexual orientation?
Her race?

I believe all three apply with the charge resonating the least among the public.
Click to expand...
She was well known prior to her detainment especially by the black and brown community. Hell I knew of her when she played in college and I’m by no means a college basketball fan of either gender. But, eliminate her popularity in the US, she’s very very well known in Russia and was prior to her detainment as she played there professionally during the WNBA offseason.

I have friends that have no clue who Bryce Young is or hell even Sidney Crosby, so does that mean they’re not well known?

Absolutely nobody I know gives a damn about her race or sexual orientation
 
ElephantStomp said:
She was well known prior to her detainment especially by the black and brown community. Hell I knew of her when she played in college and I’m by no means a college basketball fan of either gender. But, eliminate her popularity in the US, she’s very very well known in Russia and was prior to her detainment as she played there professionally during the WNBA offseason.

I have friends that have no clue who Bryce Young is or hell even Sidney Crosby, so does that mean they’re not well known?

Absolutely nobody I know gives a damn about her race or sexual orientation
Click to expand...
I damn sure don't.... but you don't know me, so I guess you're still in the clear. :p
Clarification on my part. I don't give 2 shits who someone is... IMO today's society won't take any responsibility when they fuck up. You think what she did wasn't a "big deal"... If I were to load, say, 3 - 5 count pack of marijuana cigs. in my luggage in Colorado and drive home to Alabama, I would think "no big deal" right? I get pulled over in Alabama and they find it, guess what? They're not going to give 2 shits even if I'm a world famous midget, tranny, Porn star, my ass is going to jail... My opinion, you do something wrong, you break a law, no matter who you are, you own it and stop trying to use politics, gender, race or whatever the fuck you think you're "owed" because you think society is oppressing your million dollar plus ass.
 
Last edited:
The Russians viewed this as swapping a criminal for a criminal. The marine is considered a spy and the Russians wanted a spy that the Germans are holding in exchange. The Germans keep saying no as this isn’t the first time the subject has been broached. The Biden admin thought they were putting public pressure on the Russians when they announced that they were going to get the two for one swap. Further evidence of the idiocy and ineptitude of American politicians. Everything is a photo-op or a cool sound bite to them. Carry on
 
XXL TideFan said:
The Russians viewed this as swapping a criminal for a criminal. The marine is considered a spy and the Russians wanted a spy that the Germans are holding in exchange. The Germans keep saying no as this isn’t the first time the subject has been broached. The Biden admin thought they were putting public pressure on the Russians when they announced that they were going to get the two for one swap. Further evidence of the idiocy and ineptitude of American politicians. Everything is a photo-op or a cool sound bite to them. Carry on
Click to expand...
Just remember. Anything we give to the Russians is worth it if one Amer4ican comes home.
 

Similar threads

G
| FTBL The Crumbling of the Third Saturday (from Oct. 2008. Bumped for look back.)
Replies
18
Views
2K
TerryP
TerryP
Back
Top Bottom