| NEWS The NCAA needs to take a strong stand against Arkansas law that will allow guns in stadiums

TerryP

Staff
Imagine this scenario.

It’s a Saturday night in mid-October. The undefeated Alabama Crimson Tide have come into Donald W. Reynolds Razorback Stadium to take on a fellow undefeated SEC rival in the Arkansas Razorbacks. The stakes of the game and a long day of pregame festivities have brought this soldout crowd of 72,000 to a fever pitch as they enter the final seconds of the fourth quarter with a 31-28 Razorbacks lead. Yet on the last play of the game, the referees call what seems like a phantom pass interference call on Arkansas in the end zone, setting up an extra play and eventual Alabama win.

The capacity crowd erupts in anger. The kind of sports-induced flash blindness that makes normally rational people say and do temporarily irrational things that they wouldn’t do in any other setting.

Now imagine if several thousand people in that crowd all had loaded handguns.

That’s the very real predicament that the NCAA, conferences, universities and fans will all have to consider during sporting events in Arkansas after the state’s governor signed a gun rights measure into law Wednesday that will allow concealed handguns at state colleges and other government buildings.

Any resident with a concealed handgun license will be allowed to bring their weapon into these public places as long as they undergo eight hours of active-shooter training. The law won’t take effect until January 2018, but this has to be somewhat of a terrifying prospect for administrators who now face the prospect of sending their athletes and staffs into a hostile environment with opposing fans who are carrying live weapons.

As it stands right now, fans at Razorback Stadium are not allowed to bring in beach balls, umbrellas or baby strollers, but by the 2018 season they will be able to bring in licensed firearms that could potentially fatally wound fellow spectators, players and officials.

And even if every gun owner packing heat inside the stadium happens to be a responsible one, is it fair that coaches and players not only have to worry about protecting themselves from opposing defenses but from any number of safety hazards in the stands?

Do we want to bring the possibility of legal guns into scenes like the following, which occurred after an upset loss to Toledo in 2015?


Prior to this legislation, universities in Arkansas all had the individual choice to allow faculty and staff to carry concealed handguns on campus if the schools allowed it. None of them did.

In a January statement regarding the then bill, HB 1249, University of Arkansas chancellor Joseph Steinmetz spoke out against the potential legislation.

“The University of Arkansas agrees with the governor’s position that the current law allowing local boards of trustees to disallow the carrying of guns on campus is working and doesn’t need to be changed,” Steinmetz said on January 24th.

“Our own law enforcement officers do not believe that the campus would be safer if guns are permitted. We have serious concerns about increasing the number of armed individuals posing a significant threat, particularly in an active situation when officers must make immediate determinations about who is a threat.

Also, though not as important as the safety of campus, a campus carry bill has the potential to negatively affect the recruitment and retention of students, faculty and staff.”

(Emails from FOX Sports to the NCAA, SEC and Arkansas athletic department requesting comment on the new law were not immediately returned Wednesday.)

If the university chancellor’s opinion isn’t enough, what about the representative whose Fayetteville district includes the University campus?

“People like to have a good time before the game, during the game, people get emotional and angry during the game,” Democratic Rep. Greg Leding told the AP. “I think the idea of introducing loaded weapons into those situations is just ridiculous.”

So while the head of the university and a local lawmaker realize what a potential safety hazard this law could be, there’s not much they can do about it at this point.

But this is where specific conferences and the NCAA in particular can apply their might.

Arkansas football is the biggest spectacle in the state, followed by its basketball program. If the NCAA (with the support of every other athletic director in the SEC) issues a blanket statement that for the safety of its student-athletes and staff, they will not allow opposing teams to play in Arkansas while this campus carry law remains in effect, the social and economic pressure would force a change in the law.

While the NCAA didn’t impact events at individual universities in the state with their reaction to North Carolina’s 2016 HB2 “bathroom bill,” they did pull seven championship events in 2016-17 with over 100 more in the next four years in jeopardy at a cost of reportedly over $250 million in lost revenue to the state.

If the governor and state representatives in Arkansas who voted for the bill wouldn’t listen to their university chancellor about the common sense risks of arming a portion of sports fans at live events, maybe they’ll listen to the threat of having their teams (and massive revenues) forced to play every game out of state until the law is repealed. Or at the very least altered to keep guns out of stadiums and arenas.

It’s on the NCAA to make them hear it.

http://www.foxsports.com/college-fo...s-law-that-will-allow-guns-in-stadiums-032317
 
Penn State.

Not the NCAA's business.

Baylor:

Not the NCAA's business.

While the NCAA didn’t impact events at individual universities in the state with their reaction to North Carolina’s 2016 HB2 “bathroom bill,” they did pull seven championship events in 2016-17 with over 100 more in the next four years in jeopardy at a cost of reportedly over $250 million in lost revenue to the state.

Not the NCAA's business.

If the governor and state representatives in Arkansas who voted for the bill wouldn’t listen to their university chancellor about the common sense risks of arming a portion of sports fans at live events, maybe they’ll listen to the threat of having their teams (and massive revenues) forced to play every game out of state until the law is repealed. Or at the very least altered to keep guns out of stadiums and arenas.

It’s on the NCAA to make them hear it.

Not the NCAA's business.

Last, but certainly not least.

Arkansas law.

Not the business of Fox Sports. It is the business of those who live in and vote in the state of Arkansas.

We talk about ESPN getting to political? We can add Fox to that.
 
Penn State.

Not the NCAA's business.

Baylor:

Not the NCAA's business.



Not the NCAA's business.



Not the NCAA's business.

Last, but certainly not least.

Arkansas law.

Not the business of Fox Sports. It is the business of those who live in and vote in the state of Arkansas.

We talk about ESPN getting to political? We can add Fox to that.

Getting past the politics and the NCAA, do you see any inherit danger for fans and nuts alike? I've seen a lot of drunks and fights at football games, and no one will ever see Tusk and herd anywhere near Fayetteville when this one passes.
 
I totally understand what you're saying, but nothing is keeping anyone from keeping a gun in their vehicle and pulling it out at a time like this in the parking lot. I honestly do not believe this will encourage people to carry guns to a football game at Arkansas. Sure, some will do it just because they can, but I highly doubt we see an uptick. And to be more realistic, if someone wanted to carry a gun, they'll carry a gun whether it's allowed or not. I always kept a gun in my truck when I was in class, and always kept it as I had a family and if anyone fucked with us, they'd be taken care of as I will protect my family to the death. A simple university rule did not scare me one bit from the bigger picture of life. I relate it to no alcohol being allowed, but we all know there are thousands of fans and students that sneak that into the stadium, and that's way more dangerous in the bigger picture than a gun to me with all of the fallout that can happen. If this group slammed up against my car, multiple people would have gotten ran over as I don't play that shit simply because they were drunk and think they can take on the world.

At Georgia Tech there are crimes committed against students on a daily basis almost, and they are picked on because they are inner city and these crooks know they are not allowed to carry a weapon, yet know they have high dollar phones, laptops, and other electronics on them. To me, that's a sitting duck that is just begging to be made a victim. Now, give that kid a revolver, and I am willing to bet petty theft and such will cease, for the most part. Nothing is ever perfect, but I feel these students have every right to protect theirselves.
 
If I am a wild redneck I will not be taking the 8 hour course to carry at the stadium. Only the responsible gun owner does that course. And if you want to see a stupidity preventer.. if Bill Joe Redneck gets drunk.. he will think twice about messing with some normal fan watching the game because he will have to wonder if ol' boy is packing.

Same reason why you don't here about home invasions in Alabama very often.. they know they will get shot. Even grandma will put a hole in you if you break in to their house. The best way to stop a bad person with a gun is several good people with guns.

The other side of this for the stadiums who ban legal gun owners is just like movie theatres that ban guns. Do you really think that a bad guy who is intending to go in and shoot everybody is going to see that sign and go.. wait a minute.. this sign says I can't bring my gun.. now I can't massacre everyone? The only people who will obey the sign and not carry their legal weapon inside are the guys you want to have a gun in case something bad happens.

I think it's smart of Arkansas and may prevent some crazy person from picking them as a target.
 
if anyone honestly believes that guns are not present in just about every stadium on every saturday during football season, then they are pretty much clueless.
 
If I am a wild redneck I will not be taking the 8 hour course to carry at the stadium. Only the responsible gun owner does that course. And if you want to see a stupidity preventer.. if Bill Joe Redneck gets drunk.. he will think twice about messing with some normal fan watching the game because he will have to wonder if ol' boy is packing.

Same reason why you don't here about home invasions in Alabama very often.. they know they will get shot. Even grandma will put a hole in you if you break in to their house. The best way to stop a bad person with a gun is several good people with guns.

The other side of this for the stadiums who ban legal gun owners is just like movie theatres that ban guns. Do you really think that a bad guy who is intending to go in and shoot everybody is going to see that sign and go.. wait a minute.. this sign says I can't bring my gun.. now I can't massacre everyone? The only people who will obey the sign and not carry their legal weapon inside are the guys you want to have a gun in case something bad happens.

I think it's smart of Arkansas and may prevent some crazy person from picking them as a target.

i'd like to add that those signs carry no power and no force of law. they are only rules and you can not be arrest or detained for carrying a gun into a non-government place that has a no weapons policy/sign. all they can do is ask you to leave. and if you don't, only THEN can you be charged.....with trespassing.

and again, if anyone thinks that guns are not present in theaters on a daily basis across this country, again they are pretty much clueless.
 
And to be more realistic, if someone wanted to carry a gun, they'll carry a gun whether it's allowed or not.

In this thread, so far, that is the general consensus.

, do you see any inherit danger for fans and nuts alike?

By saying it's an inherent danger is suggesting this "danger" is a permanent thing just because some will be allowed to carry.

Some. That being the key word.

What the writer here fails to acknowledge--likely due to him not having a clue--is a very key phrase:

The measure approved by Republican Gov. Asa Hutchinson allows someone with a concealed handgun license to carry at the locations if they undergo up to eight hours of active-shooter training. Hutchinson chaired a National Rifle Association task force that called for trained, armed staff at schools after the 2012 elementary school shooting in Newtown, Connecticut.
To obtain one of those isn't like walking into the DMV and getting a drivers license.

** If I were to have the opportunity to talk to the author I'd ask this, "Do you think people should have background checks before being allowed to own a gun?" You know what he's likely to say (IF he's not one of the anti- 2nd amendment folk.) Then, "Do you think someone who is licensed to carry, concealed, should be allowed to carry?" Again, I suspect he'd say, "yes."

When I think about this the only thing I can think of--firearm related--that's harder to get than a concealed carry permit is a suppressor.
 
If I am a wild redneck I will not be taking the 8 hour course to carry at the stadium. Only the responsible gun owner does that course. And if you want to see a stupidity preventer.. if Bill Joe Redneck gets drunk.. he will think twice about messing with some normal fan watching the game because he will have to wonder if ol' boy is packing.

Same reason why you don't here about home invasions in Alabama very often.. they know they will get shot. Even grandma will put a hole in you if you break in to their house. The best way to stop a bad person with a gun is several good people with guns.

The other side of this for the stadiums who ban legal gun owners is just like movie theatres that ban guns. Do you really think that a bad guy who is intending to go in and shoot everybody is going to see that sign and go.. wait a minute.. this sign says I can't bring my gun.. now I can't massacre everyone? The only people who will obey the sign and not carry their legal weapon inside are the guys you want to have a gun in case something bad happens.

I think it's smart of Arkansas and may prevent some crazy person from picking them as a target.

What exactly is broke socially in Arkansas that needs that much fixing? Other then an occasional fight and insults about your ancestry, what isn't working here on Saturdays in the fall that has the natives so restless? I can't recall anyone losing their life during a SEC game because someone was illegally gutshot or stabbed and couldn't defend themselves, maybe you have the current data? Why is it necessary to potentially arm 80,000 hog callers at this time in history at an Alabama game?
 
You have to have eight hours of training to have a permit in Tennessee (along with lots of other qualifications). I took it, got mine, renewed it for a lifetime. You better believe I take it to the movie theater. I couldn't carry at the SEC Championship game because they explicitly stated guns would not be allowed, and if you attended two years ago you went through a fairly rigorous screening at the gate. Lots of skoal cans laying out but not a handgun in sight.

All that said, if you're licensed to carry everywhere else, there's not much difference in carrying at a ballgame. Any dude that walks out with a rifle in a movie theater where I live might look like Swiss cheese with all the permits in my town.
 
What exactly is broke socially in Arkansas that needs that much fixing? Other then an occasional fight and insults about your ancestry, what isn't working here on Saturdays in the fall that has the natives so restless? I can't recall anyone losing their life during a SEC game because someone was illegally gutshot or stabbed and couldn't defend themselves, maybe you have the current data? Why is it necessary to potentially arm 80,000 hog callers at this time in history at an Alabama game?


At this time in history when active shooters on campus happen monthly, when a kid go into a church and guns down innocent people, when derainged people go into a movie theater and start firing, when people drive thru crowds of innocent people and then get out and start stabbing or firing women and children.. When that kind of stuff is more the norm.. I want someone with a gun who can stop them. I carry everywhere I go, I am former military, a husband and a father who is tasked with protecting my family from a dark and violent world that has proven the crazies can be right beside you. I am one of the guys you want int the theatre if crap goes down.

Also consider this. do you think a stadium with 80,000 innocent Americans who are predominately christian would be a possible target for a terrorist threat?
 
How is this not Fox's business? And how is it only the business of Arkansas? I dont want our players, fans, band, students having to go a dipshit hillbilly place like Arkansas when guns are allowed IN THE STADIUM. How gotdamn insane have we become as a country. People just think this shit is okay, its normal. Want to bring a pistol to a football game? SURE! People have completely lost it.

Also consider this. do you think a stadium with 80,000 innocent Americans who are predominately christian would be a possible target for a terrorist threat?

Oh yeah, Im sure ISIS is just sitting back "yeah, cant wait to make it to America so we can blow up a fucking Arkansas football game." Jesus man, use a TINY bit of logic and reason please, Im begging you. Not to mention, if you want to bring up terrorist attacks. What is you packing a pistol going to do if one of this nut bars brings a bomb into a stadium? There are cops at every football game, they are the ones that are supposed to be handling this. Not Bubba up in the stands shooting at what he thinks is a terrorist (when its really the guy that works down the street at the 7/11 holding cell phone that "Bubba" mistakes as a gun) and then Bubba accidentally shoots a kid cause hes a moron with four working braincells.

This kind of thing blows my mind. The answer for gun violence is more guns, makes me want to run my fucking head through a wall.
 
In this thread, so far, that is the general consensus.



By saying it's an inherent danger is suggesting this "danger" is a permanent thing just because some will be allowed to carry.

Some. That being the key word.

What the writer here fails to acknowledge--likely due to him not having a clue--is a very key phrase:

The measure approved by Republican Gov. Asa Hutchinson allows someone with a concealed handgun license to carry at the locations if they undergo up to eight hours of active-shooter training. Hutchinson chaired a National Rifle Association task force that called for trained, armed staff at schools after the 2012 elementary school shooting in Newtown, Connecticut.
To obtain one of those isn't like walking into the DMV and getting a drivers license.

** If I were to have the opportunity to talk to the author I'd ask this, "Do you think people should have background checks before being allowed to own a gun?" You know what he's likely to say (IF he's not one of the anti- 2nd amendment folk.) Then, "Do you think someone who is licensed to carry, concealed, should be allowed to carry?" Again, I suspect he'd say, "yes."

When I think about this the only thing I can think of--firearm related--that's harder to get than a concealed carry permit is a suppressor.

That first part is such a stupid straw man. People that murder people are going to murder people whether there is a law against it. People that smoke meth are going to smoke meth whether their is law against it. Using your logic, lets just do away with all laws. The point of the law is when someone breaks it, you can actually do something about it. Not to mention, there are metal detectors or bag searches at pretty much every stadium in America at this point so if you try to bring a gun into a stadium you're probably getting caught.

Someone that has a conceal carry permit makes me no less worried when it comes to emotional shit like football games where people do a lot of dumb shit out of anger (tea bagging LSU fans for example or poisoning trees). Tho I do like the idea of being required to take a safety course to receive a permit rather than just simply being able to walk into the sheriff's office and get one like you can in Bama (then again our brilliant politicians are getting ready to completely get rid of permits all together because they're gonna make us safer)...
 
At this time in history when active shooters on campus happen monthly, when a kid go into a church and guns down innocent people, when derainged people go into a movie theater and start firing, when people drive thru crowds of innocent people and then get out and start stabbing or firing women and children.. When that kind of stuff is more the norm.. I want someone with a gun who can stop them. I carry everywhere I go, I am former military, a husband and a father who is tasked with protecting my family from a dark and violent world that has proven the crazies can be right beside you. I am one of the guys you want int the theatre if crap goes down.

Also consider this. do you think a stadium with 80,000 innocent Americans who are predominately christian would be a possible target for a terrorist threat?

Well, it's good to hear that nothing, in your opinion, has changed socially in Fayetteville that would necessarily warrant preemptive strikes against Bama fans with deadly force? Save the NRA position for another day and person, cause the only issue here is the potential stupid of this Arkansas law. Why would a sane person think about even going to a football game thinking that potentially 80,000 hogvilians feel it neccessary to arm themselves with deadly weapons upon our arrival, just in case? In this day of HD and ticket prices, I'm not worried about arming myself, just in case, I ain't going.

By the way, my wife and I recently went to one of our grandaughter's kindergarden recitals, and we went unarmed. I know, we were taking a chance, cause bad things have happened before. That's just the way we roll.
 
That first part is such a stupid straw man
You see it that way due to your political views and age.

I see it differently due to my political view and age.

Even though I disagree with you, I'd never call your viewpoint a "stupid straw man." It's characterizations like this that engender the opinions people have today of those in the "progressive movement". If you don't like an idea, the first reactions are "stupid, racist, etc."

----

If you lived in Arkansas and were a Hog fan, I'd be happy to support you if you needed a safe space. ;) :D
 
"After they receive this enhanced permit, they can concealed carry at public colleges, airports, polling places, sporting events, most state offices and the State Capitol."

Campus Carry Bill Signed into Law by AR Governor

I don't have a problem with HB1249. What I do find interesting, they wouldn't let us bring a backpack into the game, nor would they let us bring an umbrella when we went to a game there about 5-6 years ago.

They have a great venue btw, if you haven't been to a game there you should go.
 
You see it that way due to your political views and age.

I see it differently due to my political view and age.

Even though I disagree with you, I'd never call your viewpoint a "stupid straw man." It's characterizations like this that engender the opinions people have today of those in the "progressive movement". If you don't like an idea, the first reactions are "stupid, racist, etc."

----

If you lived in Arkansas and were a Hog fan, I'd be happy to support you if you needed a safe space. ;) :D

It has absolutely nothing to do with my age nor political views. Seriously, make a logical argument against what I said. Someone will cook meth whether it is allowed or not, so we shouldnt have laws against cooking meth right? RIGHT? You cant have it both ways, either you use that argument for every law or stop making that straw man argument. And sorry if I think something is a stupid I say it.

I dont need a safe space because Im not a PC bitch.
 
Well, it's good to hear that nothing, in your opinion, has changed socially in Fayetteville that would necessarily warrant preemptive strikes against Bama fans with deadly force? Save the NRA position for another day and person, cause the only issue here is the potential stupid of this Arkansas law. Why would a sane person think about even going to a football game thinking that potentially 80,000 hogvilians feel it neccessary to arm themselves with deadly weapons upon our arrival, just in case? In this day of HD and ticket prices, I'm not worried about arming myself, just in case, I ain't going.

By the way, my wife and I recently went to one of our grandaughter's kindergarden recitals, and we went unarmed. I know, we were taking a chance, cause bad things have happened before. That's just the way we roll.


I don't think the Hog fans are arming themselves to fend off Alabama fans..lol I can see we disagree but I wish they would pass this type of law at every stadium. It would make these events less of a target for people who intend to do bad things.

I hope her recital went well and most schools around here have armed policeman at the only entrance of the school all day. Which makes me feel better about leaving my firearm in the car when I enter. I have 4 kids and spend a ton of time at their schools for programs, athletics and stuff.
 
What I do find interesting, they wouldn't let us bring a backpack into the game, nor would they let us bring an umbrella when we went to a game there about 5-6 years ago.
If I'm not mistaken, it's going to be a SEC rule for "clear bag only" this upcoming season.

I caught something in the Tide Pride renewal that said they'd be giving those away. IIRC.
 
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