🏈 Alabama Football: Is It Time To Stop Yellow Hammer Cheer and Show More Class?

[Argo]

http://www.nizkor.org/features/fallacies/

That will help for the people who are a little lost.

 

[It Takes Eleven]

No, I think you are an 18 year old kid because you say you have never met a person who doesn't like RJ. I could say that I am a 10' tall alien from mars and it is just as valid. The logical fallacy of straw man got tossed out earlier. What you have done by saying you have never met... is make an assertion by appeal to popularity. From an argument position it is the same as saying "Because I said so," and "it is right because lots of people say it is." You are using your lack of personal experience in not having met people to add merit to your point. That is worse than straw man in logic.

Going back to my original point with the football players walking off the field...

I see them with respect. They are fallen warriors. I respond with appreciation for the game I just had the opportunity to witness because they represented their institution.

You respond by taunting them for losing.

I take issue with that.

My argument has nothing to do with whether or not someone is a sidewalk alumnus or not. I didn't go to Alabama. I can't post on the JSU message boards even though I played for Burgess because I am a Bama fan and the JSU message boards are nasty to people who cheer for anyone other than JSU.

I feel that it is morally wrong to taunt. At best RJ is prideful.

You may need to check your login, Big Fan. Someone stole your password the other day to go into great detail of how much they thought Troy sucked. Everything about it, and then gleefully noted the taunting insult contained in an often used song played by the band. Do you think that song should be banned as well?

 

[Big_Fan]

I can't disagree with your point at all, the only problem I ever had is the way you argued it. Calling people children and implying that they are trailer trash just doesn't seem like a very logical way to go about an argument in which you're point is that what they're doing isn't classy.

Ah but there is the rub. Nate this goes out to you, too. I never called anyone a child, nor did I imply that anyone was trailer trash.

I said that I had never met anyone who liked it other than...

in response to...

I have never met anyone who doesn't like...

...and the point has been made I think. His assertion as to lack of meeting anyone was marginalizing those who don't like RJ - of whom there are many. (kind of offensive, really) By committing the same fallacy and relegating RJ supporters to kids and non-college educated, I marginalized his position. (turning it around)

And I called the cheer trailer trashy because it is. It wreaks of barner...or at the very least Ole Miss Rebel. I never said "people who support RJ are trailer trash" or "all people who do RJ are trailer trash." Saying that I did is the straw man that was mentioned earlier.

 

[Big_Fan]

You may need to check your login, Big Fan. Someone stole your password the other day to go into great detail of how much they thought Troy sucked. Everything about it, and then gleefully noted the taunting insult contained in an often used song played by the band. Do you think that song should be banned as well?

Entirely different issue. Post Hoc poisoning of the well. Troy can suck and JSU can play a song and shout that Troy sucks. It has no bearing, relevance, or similarity to taunting a football team that just lost. Also...nothing taunting about stating "Troy Sucks." It is a simple statement only relevant within the context of the rivalry. Shouting we just beat the hell out of you at San Jose after a humiliating defeat is morally objectionable.

 

[Big_Fan]

http://www.nizkor.org/features/fallacies/

That will help for the people who are a little lost.

Cool find. I am hoping to have the opportunity to teach logic at Western KY next year, though I think I will spend more time on statement logic and truth tables than anything else.

 

[RollTideinGA]

No, I think you are an 18 year old kid because you say you have never met a person who doesn't like RJ. I could say that I am a 10' tall alien from mars and it is just as valid. The logical fallacy of straw man got tossed out earlier. What you have done by saying you have never met... is make an assertion by appeal to popularity. From an argument position it is the same as saying "Because I said so," and "it is right because lots of people say it is." You are using your lack of personal experience in not having met people to add merit to your point. That is worse than straw man in logic.

Going back to my original point with the football players walking off the field...

I see them with respect. They are fallen warriors. I respond with appreciation for the game I just had the opportunity to witness because they represented their institution.

You respond by taunting them for losing.

I take issue with that.

My argument has nothing to do with whether or not someone is a sidewalk alumnus or not. I didn't go to Alabama. I can't post on the JSU message boards even though I played for Burgess because I am a Bama fan and the JSU message boards are nasty to people who cheer for anyone other than JSU.

I feel that it is morally wrong to taunt. At best RJ is prideful.

Hey listen. I'm ending this on my side. I stated a simple fact. I know plenty of Bama fans and I have yet to run into any that say man I hate that cheer. I have been a Tide Prider for 10 years now and the people that sit in Section B each week we do the cheer. I'm sorry but I have not met anyone in person that says they dont like the cheer. I'm not making an argument in court and saying I know every bama fan personally.

Also why would I lie about my age on an Alabama forum? Why would anyone? Thats a stupid assumption on your part. Trust issues? This isnt Facebook, MySpace, or some dating service. I'm not lying about my age to see porn or a beer company website. To say I lie because I am on the net is crazy just because we havent met in person. My earlier comment was due to the bickering between you and Nate. I simply stated I've always wondered how these would go without the internet in the middle.


I respect the fact that you see players walking off the field as warriors, but as a combat vet and my US Army service I dont truly see them as warriors. Seriously I served with real warriors and we put our lives on the line everyday. The over exaggeration of atheltes going to war and warrior mentality often gets on my nerves. I'm done with the conversation. We'll agree to disagree. I dont think the cheer has anything to do with class or infringing on anyone's rights. Is the cheer a little arrogant and taunting, yes.

You can make assumptions all day about me and you'll be more wrong than an Auburn fan.

As Paul Harvey would say "Good day!"

Roll Tide!

 

[RollTideinGA]

Where does it say "we just beat the hell out of you?"

Yawn! Hey I didnt post all the lyrics, and I'm not sure if it says it. I am just pointing out that RJYH was used prior to Coach Bryant retiring.

 

[It Takes Eleven]

Entirely different issue. Post Hoc poisoning of the well. Troy can suck and JSU can play a song and shout that Troy sucks. It has no bearing, relevance, or similarity to taunting a football team that just lost. Also...nothing taunting about stating "Troy Sucks." It is a simple statement only relevant within the context of the rivalry. Shouting we just beat the hell out of you at San Jose after a humiliating defeat is morally objectionable.

Let me get this right. A rehearsed slight toward another group is not taunting? Is it prideful? Is it okay to taunt a rival in defeats that are other than humiliating? Is a victory that is less than close but falls short of humiliating in that RJYH sweet spot?

 

[RollTideinGA]

I still miss "The Man Show".

That was a good times show right there. Those guys just had fun and did what they wanted.

 

[Argo]

Cool find. I am hoping to have the opportunity to teach logic at Western KY next year, though I think I will spend more time on statement logic and truth tables than anything else.

Alpha Male, who rarely posts anymore, hooked me with the fallacies. It's actually helped me tremendously in my profession. I'd encourage everyone to read/study that site.

 

[Big_Fan]

Thats about as stupid an argument as the people that don't think non alumni should cheer for Alabama.

So what if you spent hundreds of hours conditioning and blah blah blah. You go into the game knowing one team is going to lose.

Should Bama refuse to play teams we are favored over because it might hurt their poor little feelings when we beat them as expected? Should our team not hit other players as hard as they can because our players are more talented? I mean seriously.

It gets on my nerves so bad when people can't respect the fact that other people are allowed to make their own decisions about something. Instead of respecting others rights they try and ban everything they don't like or agree with.


If you don't like it, either don't participate, leave early, put in some ear plugs, or even pass out ear plugs to opposing teams so they don't have to hear it if they don't want to.

I want to clarify a thing or two.

(1) I was calm and had simply state my opinion until nate comes along and wrote this post insulting my position. Nate, you can claim you did or didn't do whatever, but this post you use snide language "blah blah blah," and call my rather eloquent argument "about as stupid an argument as the people...."

That was insulting.

You can say you didn't attack me, but that was an insult.

(2) If someone with access to the writer site will look, I posted the Trickle down at 2:30 this morning. It took 6 hours to write and several hours after posting it to edit. To make a long story short, I have not slept since night before last because I was up all night doing that piece. I am probably over reacting right now, but that insult is what set me off. I just wont post anymore on the subject.

 

[Big_Fan]

Let me get this right. A rehearsed slight toward another group is not taunting? Is it prideful? Is it okay to taunt a rival in defeats that are other than humiliating? Is a victory that is less than close but falls short of humiliating in that RJYH sweet spot?

I can't help it if you don't see the difference in a the trumpet line shouting "Troy Sucks" in the middle of dixie, and 100,000 people screaming we just beat the hell out of you. Troy Sucks in dixie is not university sanctioned, it is a band thing.

 

[It Takes Eleven]

I can't help it if you don't see the difference in a the trumpet line shouting "Troy Sucks" in the middle of dixie, and 100,000 people screaming we just beat the hell out of you. Troy Sucks in dixie is not university sanctioned, it is a band thing.

So it's a closely guarded secret between the band and you? No one else knows about it or joins in? I can't help it if you can't see the inconsistency of your actions. Whether it's sanctioned or "impromptu", joined in by few or all, pride is pride, insults are insults, and taunts are taunts.

 

[Big_Fan]

So it's a closely guarded secret between the band and you? No one else knows about it or joins in? I can't help it if you can't see the inconsistency of your actions. Whether it's sanctioned or "impromptu", joined in by few or all, pride is pride, insults are insults, and taunts are taunts.

\

Yep pride is pride, etc.

which is why I differentiate between yelling "Troy Sucks" in the middle of Dixie when JSU is playing Ole Miss, and 100,000 Alabama fans shouting we just beat the hell out of you at a team that just lost to Alabama. One is arrogant, boasting, prideful, and the other isn't.

 

[It Takes Eleven]

\

Yep pride is pride, etc.

which is why I differentiate between yelling "Troy Sucks" in the middle of Dixie when JSU is playing Ole Miss, and 100,000 Alabama fans shouting we just beat the hell out of you at a team that just lost to Alabama. One is arrogant, boasting, prideful, and the other isn't.

So if it's not an arrogant, boastful or prideful insult, what type of insult is it?

 

[Big_Fan]

So if it's not an arrogant, boastful or prideful insult, what type of insult is it?

Just an insult.

There is no "We just" component. It is what it is. Troy sucks. It is a band cheer (related to Johnny Long, the former band director at TSU), not sanctioned by the school, and it is done any time dixie is played - not just after beating TSU. In fact, JSU has not played Troy in football for 9 years and they still do it every time Dixie is played. What you probably can't fathom, is that the JSU/Troy Dixie cheer is about the band, not the football team. It has to do with Johnny Long - a former student of Dr. David Walters who went to Troy as band director. There is a trombone ditty to the tune of Mickey Mouse Club theme that I won't repeat the words to.

But if you want to compare it to RJ, go ahead.

 

[BamaCore]

You can't have your cake and eat it too.

An insult is an insult.

A taunt is a taunt.

It is what it is.

 

[Nate]

I want to clarify a thing or two.

(1) I was calm and had simply state my opinion until nate comes along and wrote this post insulting my position. Nate, you can claim you did or didn't do whatever, but this post you use snide language "blah blah blah," and call my rather eloquent argument "about as stupid an argument as the people...."

That was insulting.

You can say you didn't attack me, but that was an insult.

(2) If someone with access to the writer site will look, I posted the Trickle down at 2:30 this morning. It took 6 hours to write and several hours after posting it to edit. To make a long story short, I have not slept since night before last because I was up all night doing that piece. I am probably over reacting right now, but that insult is what set me off. I just wont post anymore on the subject.

I find it laughable that you respond only to the parts where you have a little bit of ground to stand on, yet fail to to admit that your moral high ground of " taunting is morally wrong, but I condone physical violence as a means of retaliation towards getting my feelings hurt" then you turn around and want to play the " you started it " game.

If you have not learned this yet, internet boards are not places to let yourself feel insulted. Its so hard to convey emotion and context without tone of voice or body language being present. If you knew me or ever had a conversation in person with me you would have taken that post completely different and realized there was no harsh intent at all. That being said I have gone back and included emoticons to help u understand my original statement.

Thats about as stupid an argument as the people that don't think non alumni should cheer for Alabama. :bird: )

So what if you spent hundreds of hours conditioning and blah blah blah:blah-blah:.(too lazy to type the rest of the stuff you said :bolt You go into the game knowing one team is going to lose.

Should Bama refuse to play teams we are favored over because it might hurt their poor little feelings when we beat them as expected? :bsflag::flash::nutkick: Should our team not hit other players as hard as they can because our players are more talented?:bolt: I mean seriously. anic:

It gets on my nerves so bad when people can't respect the fact that other people are allowed to make their own decisions about something. :halo: Instead of respecting others rights they try and ban everything they don't like or agree with. :nopity: :headscratch:


If you don't like it, either don't participate, leave early, put in some ear plugs, or even pass out ear plugs to opposing teams so they don't have to hear it if they don't want to. :hyper: :stick: :grimace:

ps. don't take things so freaking seriously its the internet

 

[Argo]

Emoticons. Ending differences since 1996.

 

[Nate]

Emoticons. Ending differences since 1996.

:cheers: getting :flash: and :bootyshake: since 1893


:id-hit-it: