🏈 The unintended cost of success - ticket prices and seat relocations

[TerryP]

What aren't you understanding about the demand not being there? Demand is down all over college football. You see all of the open seats in the stadium the last few years? Costs of Gameday, lackluster opponents and competition, and just the time associated has people not caring anymore about going. As @planomateo said, it's not as black and white as you are trying to play it

IF they are not having an issue selling the luxury suites we know that demand is there. The last time suite sells came up they were moving along really well.

It's interesting you note empty seats when seating capacity is being reduced which is a response to the market you're also pointing to here. To me, that's pretty black and white.

 

[TerryP]

When has attending a football game NOT been a luxury item?

In a very honest statement, I have to say "as a student." That opens another can of worms.

It was a luxury item in 1952 and it's still one in 2019. I have no issue with luxury boxes, do whatever but you should also then try to make OTHER seating options more affordable, too. Giving more people options to attend is certainly not a bad thing, especially in the long run. Eventually Alabama will not be a perennial power again. There will be dry spells, it happens with every program, not matter how huge the dynasty. Turning off non-rich fans during the up swing won't do you any favors in 6-win seasons.

Then I don't see where your complaints are coming from. You don't have an issue with Tide Pride and their efforts as a fundraising arm for athletics. So this seating issue is moot. The seats being moved (or lost if they so choose) don't fit with where I took your thought process going ...

However, you do have an issue with ticket pricing for those who are not a part ot Tide Pride, correct? I'm assuming that's what you meant with "OTHER seating options."

Are you wanting more single game tickets? That's "other." Smaller packages? Those have been available.

But that's not what they're doing. They're adding luxury boxes and then going to raise ticket prices everywhere else, too and probably concessions which already outrageous and parking and gameday merch and everything else.

Which would be inflation, right?

There's arguments about the inflation surrounding college football outpacing the cost of living and how it's becoming harder for some to afford to attend. Which is, quite frankly, what happens with luxury ticket items.

 

[planomateo]

They’ve raised prices throughout their history.

No, they've made a decision to have a small markup on products they sell. They're doing very well as a business.

 

[ElephantStomp]

Hmmmm, wonder why they went so overboard with the Crimson Initiative and marketed Saban starting off the event with a $1M donation. They needed more of what was not there and they knew it beforehand.

Yeah, Florida State (Taggert) and Georgia Tech (Hewitt) probably thought they knew what they were doing economically as well when they made decisions that killed them financially and crippled the program for years to come. Look at Auburn with Gus, bet they thought they made a good economic decision as well with his buyout terms. The people in charge aren't always the best or all knowing.

Stadium improvements are far different than hiring coaches as are the economics.

 

[ElephantStomp]

No, they've made a decision to have a small markup on products they sell. They're doing very well as a business.

“Small markup” is still raising prices. The prices for their goods have gone up a bunch since their inception for various reasons. Obviously they’re doing very well, never said they weren’t

 

[planomateo]

“Small markup” is still raising prices. The prices for their goods have gone up a bunch since their inception for various reasons. Obviously they’re doing very well, never said they weren’t

You've missed the point completely. The lesson here isn't on raising prices, it's about the profit being too much.

From the article...

That doesn’t come cheaply, and that’s where the issue for families like the Burnettes come into play. Each seat now requires a $10,000 one-time donation and an additional $3,500 contribution every season. That doesn’t include the price of the actual tickets, which were $495 apiece last year for the top tier seats.

Burnette in 2019 paid $940 a ticket including a $480 donation for each of his four seats minus the amenities.

That same seat next year is $13,995 in the Champions Club if the initial donation is paid up front or $5,995 if spread into five equal portions. It comes with a 10-year commitment meaning each seat will cost $49,950 and only if the $495 season ticket prices never rise.

 

[ElephantStomp]

You've missed the point completely. The lesson here isn't on raising prices, it's about the profit being too much.

From the article...

Too much profit? There’s no such thing

 

[mando]

Too much profit? There’s no such thing

It's only to much profit when someone stops paying that much. lol. Hard to ever imagine there would be enough impact based on decisions like this to put a significant dent in the Bama profit machine . Maybe when Saban steps away you could see a dip but would it be enough to really cause the business model to change? I doubt it just to ingrained in our Alabama and southern culture.

 

[planomateo]

Too much profit? There’s no such thing

That's a choice.

We're going to disagree on this topic altogether.

 

[BamaFan334]

IF they are not having an issue selling the luxury suites we know that demand is there. The last time suite sells came up they were moving along really well.

It's interesting you note empty seats when seating capacity is being reduced which is a response to the market you're also pointing to here. To me, that's pretty black and white.

Luxury boxes are what, four to fifteen seats, but probably take up 200 seats? Asking, because I have no idea. You have to sell a lot less luxury boxes than seats, so yes, demand is not there. As we have also said, there will always be those that support the program and have deep pockets to do so. Corporations and companies are the ones buying these. Byrne is slow playing that part of it. The expenses will be rolling through a company, regardless if an individual's name or a company's name is on the check, believe that. So yeah, I'm pointing to a few things, one being decreased demand due to rising costs for crap like in this discussion, one being greed,and another being the superiority complex Alabama has built for itself.

 

[BamaFan334]

Stadium improvements are far different than hiring coaches as are the economics.

No, it's all dollars and cents my friend. That is black and white.

In the end when the economy starts to fall, in which it will, who will be there to cover the costs associated with these upgrades when someone ultimately defaults on their ten year agreement? Someone makes up the slack, and I bet you $1M it won't be Byrne or the Board of Trustees. It'll be another increase in donations and ticket prices.

And so we're clear, a decision to get the right coach is what got this mess started in the first place. Without Saban, these boxes would NEVER have happened. He brought a winning culture, he brought in the recruits, and he brought in the trophies. If anything, keep putting your money there. He also affects the lives of student athletes, gets them educated, gets them coached, and puts them on a killer trajectory to succeed. Now that is good business and helps out a lot of people, especially kids. He was the reason demand spiked to historic levels, and luxury stadium items are a greedy side product used to line the pockets of the executives. There are backdoor deals and money being made all over the place here. You think these decisions come because they are so pure and that they just want nicer seats for strangers they don't know and kiss ass to until they get that check? They'll turn on these folks too and dump them if another great idea to make more money comes around. That's not good business at all. As I have said, eventually the well runs dry.

 

[50+yeartidefan]

You raise prices when the demand is there. That’s exactly how you run a business

That may be how you ( and alot of American businesses ) are run these days....
But thats not how ethical businesses with long term sustainability are run...
You can raise prices....some....but cant just kick ur loyal customers to the curb...
Anyway...thats not how I think anyway... but to each their own

 

[mando]

As I have said, eventually the well runs dry.

Well running dry I am taking a little more literally than maybe you intended. Will it slow down? Definitely but not dry up. The question is how much and will it make a real difference? The business side will adjust and correct it before it runs dry.

 

[rick4bama]

If it was me and I was faithful in going and staying! You bet I would be very upset! I fell for the ones that are losing those seats!

 

[BamaFan334]

Well running dry I am taking a little more literally than maybe you intended. Will it slow down? Definitely but not dry up. The question is how much and will it make a real difference? The business side will adjust and correct it before it runs dry.

That's not always true. Companies go bankrupt all the time. If you mean in a capitalistic way, then you would be correct. But how many times can you correct a stadium renovation of a stadium as old as Bryant Denny? You can only add and subtract so many times. When I meant dry up, I didn't mean to $0, I just meant these $600M fundraisers will no longer be attainable. A lot of people seem to be believing in the hot shooter fallacy where you think a hot streak is a given on the next shot or a proven institution can't fail. As an accountant I have seen where you can mask problems and defer for a while, but they eventually always come to light in the end.

 

[50+yeartidefan]

That's not always true. Companies go bankrupt all the time. If you mean in a capitalistic way, then you would be correct. But how many times can you correct a stadium renovation of a stadium as old as Bryant Denny? You can only add and subtract so many times. When I meant dry up, I didn't mean to $0, I just meant these $600M fundraisers will no longer be attainable. A lot of people seem to be believing in the hot shooter fallacy where you think a hot streak is a given on the next shot or a proven institution can't fail. As an accountant I have seen where you can mask problems and defer for a while, but they eventually always come to light in the end.

And it cant happen?
Lets look at an example...
Tennessee Vols.......it has happened there...yep..they selL 70-80%....
But that doesn’t get it done....that other 30% is as important....
Go to the stadium...bathrooms stink...video board sux....seats to close together....
Some concessions closed...
They had bama level product and squeezed and squeezed....and Football fortunes fell off...and so did attendance...and they cant maintain the aging stadium and produce the in-stadium experience....look at the stadium attendance on tv...its not 70%..( except a couple major games a year) they did stuff..moved people outta ther long term seats... for corporate..
Now..corporate dont go..fans dont go... and they are struggling with $$$$$$

 

[ElephantStomp]

No, it's all dollars and cents my friend. That is black and white.

In the end when the economy starts to fall, in which it will, who will be there to cover the costs associated with these upgrades when someone ultimately defaults on their ten year agreement? Someone makes up the slack, and I bet you $1M it won't be Byrne or the Board of Trustees. It'll be another increase in donations and ticket prices.

And so we're clear, a decision to get the right coach is what got this mess started in the first place. Without Saban, these boxes would NEVER have happened. He brought a winning culture, he brought in the recruits, and he brought in the trophies. If anything, keep putting your money there. He also affects the lives of student athletes, gets them educated, gets them coached, and puts them on a killer trajectory to succeed. Now that is good business and helps out a lot of people, especially kids. He was the reason demand spiked to historic levels, and luxury stadium items are a greedy side product used to line the pockets of the executives. There are backdoor deals and money being made all over the place here. You think these decisions come because they are so pure and that they just want nicer seats for strangers they don't know and kiss ass to until they get that check? They'll turn on these folks too and dump them if another great idea to make more money comes around. That's not good business at all. As I have said, eventually the well runs dry.

I can assure you they’ll have ample capital in place for an economic slowdown/downturn. This isn’t the first time they’ve done this.

I never said they were pure or anything of the sort. That’s putting words in my mouth. Every decision a company makes is out of greed in some aspects

 

[ElephantStomp]

That may be how you ( and alot of American businesses ) are run these days....
But thats not how ethical businesses with long term sustainability are run...
You can raise prices....some....but cant just kick ur loyal customers to the curb...
Anyway...thats not how I think anyway... but to each their own

I’m a lot of things, but unethical isn’t one of them.

They’re not kicking their “loyal customers” to the curb. They offered to give them other seats now if they decline that’s on them not the damn school

I can assure you UA is sustainable.

 

[ElephantStomp]

That's a choice.

We're going to disagree on this topic altogether.

No sir I don’t believe we will agree on this topic. Different opinions keeps the world interesting.

 

[BamaFan334]

I’m a lot of things, but unethical isn’t one of them.

They’re not kicking their “loyal customers” to the curb. They offered to give them other seats now if they decline that’s on them not the damn school

I can assure you UA is sustainable.

You're not grasping the fact that it is the schools fault. They are the ones forcing a change. I emphasize the word forcing. They are offering something less, because we know they will not offer something more for less of a price, simply look at the seats they are stealing to charge more. So yes, it is the schools fault 1000%. "Hey, we're taking your seats regardless of your feelings, so either pay us more for a box, or move elsewhere."