🏀 Time may be now for Tide to fire Grant

[BAMANEWSBOT]

There is always a moment in a doomed relationship when you know it’s over. You may not always act on that initial instinct, but in hindsight it is easily recalled. Inevitably you then say to yourself, “Why the heck didn’t I do something about this thing THEN!?!”

Surely, the powers that be at Alabama are having that moment with basketball coach Anthony Grant by now.

I lost faith in Grant a long time ago, but I understood why a move wasn’t made. However, it seems the ‘Bama brass had more confidence in Grant than I thought as there has never even been as much as a whisper about his potential ouster.

There may be more than whispers after UA’s last two performances.

First was the rather uninspired effort against the South Carolina Gamecocks last Tuesday followed by a thorough thumping by Kentucky at home Saturday.

In both instances it is not so much that Alabama lost or even how they lost. It was more about the coach’s repeating patterns that have produced losing efforts before and are sure to lead to more losses. Alabama’s clock mismanagement in tight games, overall indecisiveness about timeouts and Grant’s aversion to confront officials have all been the biggest problems.

The clock mismanagement and indecisiveness were painfully evident in the loss to South Carolina. However, those should come as no surprise. I was more upset about Grant’s unwillingness to chide the officials against Kentucky.

Look, if this Kentucky team plays well, the Cats win 100 times out of 100. The Cats are just that good. They are loaded with NBA talent. However, with that crew of refs last Saturday Kentucky would win 103 out of 100 somehow.

The refs are not going to self-police or correct, though. It is on Grant to make sure the officials get the message that he is not happy with their performance. Even if an emotional outburst would not affect the final score it would at least give the players the idea that the coach was emotionally involved.

The crowd in Coleman Coliseum Saturday was practically begging for the coach to get a technical. Not because they wanted UK to get free points, but more because they just want to see some emotion- any emotion- out of the sixth year head coach.

As I sat in the building Saturday, I could not help but wonder if Grant’s lack of enthusiasm led to the crowd’s sitting on its hands. Fans can take on the personalities of their coaches and outside of a mini-run midway through the second half the crowd Saturday was complete milquetoast.

Everything about Grant’s tenure has been vanilla, though, so the response wasn’t surprising. The style of play, the lack of personality, the fan involvement; all of it.

Meanwhile, across the state Bruce Pearl is doing a bang up job of selling a program that is historically the worst program in the league. Average fans know Bruce Pearl’s thoughts from his many, many, MANY radio and TV interviews. Average fans barely know what Grant looks or sounds like.

Maybe – and maybe most importantly – Alabama never beats teams it shouldn’t under Grant. Never. Not even the occasional, slip-up, “we didn’t deserve to win but we did” win. The Tide has lost 20 straight to ranked opponents! That stat cannot be ignored at an employee review.

I wanted Grant to be Alabama’s coach. I thought he would really put the program back in the spotlight. But we are six years into this regime now and I just don’t see it coming together. With only 1 NCAA tournament trip (and a first game exit at that), it’s pretty safe to say that the Tide is not getting the best return-on-investment at roughly $2 million a year.

I hate to say it, but unless there are incredible signs of progress quickly it may be time for a break up.

Alex City Outlook reports.

 

[252BAMA]

"I wanted Grant to be Alabama’s coach. I thought he would really put the program back in the spotlight. But we are six years into this regime now and I just don’t see it coming together. With only 1 NCAA tournament trip (and a first game exit at that), it’s pretty safe to say that the Tide is not getting the best return-on-investment at roughly $2 million a year."

Ditto

 

[TheChief]

Basketball means nothing to Alabama. The school doesn't care. Why should we fans?

 

[UAgrad93]

BAMA has a rich tradition of basketball in the SEC, second only to Kentucky. The fans don't care because there is a disconnect between Grant and the fanbase. They get tired of seeing 4 guys stand around outside the 3 point arc and pass it around and then throw one up from 27 ft with no chance of going in. I live 2 hours away and it makes it close to impossible to make a game during the week. I refuse to make that trip if I am going to see the same amount of coaching that I can watch in a junior high game here in town.

 

[TheChief]

I dunno, @uagrad93 The Tide has never been past the Elite 8, and I think they've only been Elite 8 once. Ahead of Florida who has multiple national championships? Just playing the game doesn't make the history rich, but I don't know nearly as much about basketball history as the football history. You may be exactly right. Zero championships. EVER.

Money means nothing when Alabama football is concerned. I feel like Battle kept Grant due to money savings. But, maybe it was Terry who said it last year: Who would Bama get to coach?

I would just as soon see them abandon the sport, one where Alabama can never, ever win a national championship.

FWIW: Bama should trounce Pearl's Auburn team this year. Pearl's first year (that is probably a good excuse). They're absolutely terrible.

 

[UAgrad93]

@TheChief, I was referring to conference championships when I made said rich tradition and being second only to UK. (We are actually third behind UK and LSU. UK has 45 Regular season titles and we have 9). When it comes to Natty's, it is UK and UF only.
Who do we hire is true!! I mentioned this before. I spoke with Coach Sanderson awhile back and he said that there is some sort of disconnect between Grant and in state HS coaches. I think this disconnect stretches outside of BAMA as well. Coach said that it is hard for a HS coach to feel comfortable when discussing Bball with a guy that comes to your school decked out in an Armani suit. These HS coaches feel as though Grant believes he is "above" them and doesn't consider them fellow coaches.

 

[TerryP]

Basketball means nothing to Alabama. The school doesn't care. Why should we fans?

Hyperbole. I know it. You know it.

I spoke with Coach Sanderson awhile back and he said that there is some sort of disconnect between Grant and in state HS coaches.

I'm going to flip the script here a bit with a question, serious question.

How many high school coaches in the SE actually have the support system as their counterparts do in football? In the few cases that do, how many of those coaches are deep into the AAU?

Support systems translate to talent development, in my opinion. When we take the state of Alabama, and take our top players from the state, they are no better than over two-thirds of the players around the nation at their respective positions.

I don't disagree with you in the thought there's a disconnect. I do believe it encompasses a lot more than just HC at UA to HC at a specific high school.

To use an old adage of "making chicken shit into chicken salad" where are the damn eggs?

 

[UAgrad93]

Most all of the HS bball programs here in the state don't have that support system. We all know that bball in this state takes a back seat to football. When you mentioned the AAU, it makes me wonder if Grant doesn't want to be mixed with that or feels he is "better" than AAU people. There are some shady characters all over the place and AAU seems to have more than others. Some coaches don't give a shit who they have to deal with to get a kid or what they have to promise. Maybe Grant doesn't want to walk that line.

 

[TheChief]

@TerryP You're right, Terry. Hyperbole for sure. But there is a ring of truth to the statement. How many Alabama football coaches would be afforded the opportunity Grant has had? Boosters and the school would be actively searching for a coach that could bring a title to town. That urgency doesn't exist with the basketball program.

There is an expectation to win, and win big, in the football program. That isn't the case with basketball.

The point you have made in the past is correct in that comparing the two sports is comparing apples to oranges. I'm inclined to agree. However, it seems as though the university has thrown up their hands with the resignation that a championship, a national title, is not attainable at The Capstone.

 

[TerryP]

The point you have made in the past is correct in that comparing the two sports is comparing apples to oranges. I'm inclined to agree.

And I was about to say the same thing again...

However, it seems as though the university has thrown up their hands with the resignation that a championship, a national title, is not attainable at The Capstone.

That's a fans' assumption. Yet, when you take into account things like the 25 million dollar plus expenditures spent on Coleman it's demonstrated proof it's something both boosters and the administration do care about.

Flipping back to the football comparison for just a second.

DuBose had four years and he was gone. Shula had four, he was gone.

Grant is in his sixth but hasn't made the colossal blunders we saw out of both of those two football coaches.

Now, given the differences (as one, numbers allowed in turning over a roster in recruiting) year six is pretty comparable to year four in football. At least, that's how I see the two being compared. If for any other reason the amount of talent found in the southeast for football versus that of basketball should automatically extend the time given to a coach.

As far as I'm concerned the jury is still out on 2015. We're 2-2 in conference play with a good win (UT) and a bad loss (UofSC.) Tomorrow nights game should give a fairly decent definition of where this teams' mind set is right now.

BTW, @uagrad93 , you're forgetting the NC at Arkansas under Richardson. I bring that up for this reason. Stan Heath got five years, Pelphrey four, and Anderson is in his fifth. Those three coaches haven't done any better than what we've seen at Bama—what we've seen around the SEC in the last ten years. The answers they are looking for aren't much different than the ones I see the Tide looking for—where's the talent base to pull from?

 

[UAgrad93]

Forgot all about the Hogs and Nolan Richardson! Those used to be some games between Wimp and Nolan. Arky and BAMA are in pretty much the same position. UNC, DUKE, Kansas, Kentucky, Indiana and UCLA are always going to get the top kids!

 

[TheChief]

Is your SEC program a national draw? I guess that's the question. That makes the pool much larger. One could argue Kentucky is in the Southeast. They're pulling from all over the country it seems. At least getting the cream of the cream.

@TerryP I don't even think Thursday will be the end-all. Arkansas is pretty darn good. Top 20. Now, if the Tide takes them down, that's big. Looking at what I thought might be the end of the season record, I didn't count Arkansas as a win. The Hogs might be a path into the tourney though.

Is getting in the tourney good enough? Winning one game in the tourney?

I do have only a fan's perspective.

 

[TerryP]

Is your SEC program a national draw? I guess that's the question.

It's the right question, in my opinion. Mizzou and A&M don't fit in the category of pulling talent from the southeast. Kentucky sure doesn't either. It can be argued that even though Florida is at the farthest point southeast of any school it's more of a northern state when it comes to their talent pool. There's a huge influx of talent that's come into the state that doesn't call the south their home, ya know? But good lord, who is UF this season to use as an example?!?

It's not the win, or loss, in Fayetteville I was referring. It's more along the lines of how both the staff and team handle a road game against a quality opponent.

I wasn't sold on Grant last year but didn't think the time was right to just can him and start from scratch. I'm not there yet either. I certainly don't have the same feelings about him as I did Gottfried in his last year.

Hey, just to throw you a curveball...and it's about fan perspectives.

IF Mark Gottfried hadn't been a coach in Tuscaloosa, how many fans would be screaming right now for Battle to make a run at him for the HC job?

 

[TheChief]

It's a good point. He's done well.

Gettin' a coach is like a box o' chocolates...

 

[rolltide69]

It's a good point. He's done well.

Gettin' a coach is like a box o' chocolates...

We need Wimp back> he always put a little fire in the team and knew how to coach, not stand around with a new white shirt on and doing nothing. Grant should have been gone last year if it had not been for coach Newton saving the job. Lets face it he has had to long a time to work out his experience with a few pretty good players but has not
put things together. I remember when Wimp always made a run and won some games in the Conference and the fans loved him. Even Mark had some fire with his players to get them to play.
Maybe things will get a little better after this season that is already gone down the drain.
ROLL TIDE ROLL

 

[TerryP]

@rolltide69 It's not quite apples and oranges to compare the Wimp era and Grant's but it's pretty damn close.

Think about it for a second. When Wimp was at the end of his tenure in Tuscaloosa, the Bulls were winning the first of their two "three-peats." More importantly, the guys you see playing college ball weren't even born. Your league MVP was a big guy who was well known for not being able to hit free-throws and that wasn't a point anyone made note of (the lack of fundamentals.) It was a time where defending him wasn't emphasized, fouling him was...

Shoe contracts were just entering their prime...

A LOT has changed on the professional side...which is what these kids were watching.

 

[alabama mike]

IMO, the 6 years that Grant has had in charge of the basketball program is plenty of time to get the ship going in the right direction. I am willing to see how the season plays out but if we do not make the dance, a change needs to be made. Several have mentioned in previous posts, who do we hire? Good question, I wish I knew the answer.

 

[TheChief]

So is it good enough for a basketball team to simply qualify for the tournament?

I guess it's like a football team saying "At least we went to a bowl game."

Is that good enough for Bama? Is that all the fans want?

 

[UAgrad93]

I don't think to simply "make the tourney" is the end all be all. As a fan and alumnus, I expect to compete for championships. I realize the talent level isn't as high as a Kentucky, Kansas, UNC, UConn,etc. but we "should expect to go at least 2-3 rounds each year". Repeated trips with 2 to 3 wins in the tourney will boost expectations and get recruits "wanting to be a part of that group that gets us over the hump!"

 

[psychojoe]

For whatever the reason, the in state talent level is way down from what it was in Wimp's hey day, and C M Newton before him. And with the exception of only a few HS programs, basketball is what they do when football is over. Basketball fundamentals are terrible not just in this state, but all over. Even Coach Cal's wunderkind are not sound, just very gifted. In thinking back on last Saturday's game, I am not sure if anyone on our rooster would be in UK's playing rotation. Why do we shoot from outside so much- well we don't have anyone who can post up, get the ball and either score or be fouled. We have several guys who can drive to the hoop, but everyone is switching on our ball screens, which shuts that part of our offense down.

Tonight we shot pretty well from the perimeter, played hard, did a lot of good things. I was proud of Shannon Hale for hitting that deep three to tie the game with only a fe seconds left in the OT. Then, at the other end, when Madden forces up a shot with two seconds left, Hale forgot to box out Portis, and Portis tipped in the winner. Another very tough loss, and we will find out how tough we are mentally when we play the next one.