🏈 Now that we're in and all... Let's get real

[OldPlayer]

I like Tua and feel he is a better passer than Jalen. Jalen has been great and Jalen has been terrible. However, Tua is not ready to lead a team against the #1 team in America. He's still learning the nuances of the offense and changing plays at the line of scrimmage based on what the defense is doing. Now is not the time to make a QB switch.

 

[EasyTider]

I'd like to think I'm the one that coined 'Tua Time'. Most of the time, just trying to get under the skin of a few of my favorite posters. I am in the camp that believes Tua has a higher ceiling when it comes to the passing game but I'm not foolish enough to think he's the clear cut answer for Clemson's D. He hasn't faced anything near what they present. Hurts will need to play well, probably really, really well, to win this one. He must not revert to what seems like a muscle memory flaw of fading backwards and towards the right when he feels pressure. He will need to be able to step up in the pocket, make a few throws into tight windows and take off IF necessary. My biggest concern is can we give him anything resembling a pocket. I would rather see some shakeup along the OL rather than at QB. I certainly don't pretend to know more than the staff, but is Leatherwood not ready at LT? That would allow Johnson to go back to RT where he seems to be better suited. What's the biggest challenge in moving from tackle to guard. Is Wommack at guard out of the question? Willis? I understand the cohesiveness is almost as important as individual talent but we do have time to experiment. In the end, I expect we'll see the same faces and that they will have to play their best game ever to move the ball on this talented front.

 

[Tidestalker]

I like Tua and feel he is a better passer than Jalen. Jalen has been great and Jalen has been terrible. However, Tua is not ready to lead a team against the #1 team in America. He's still learning the nuances of the offense and changing plays at the line of scrimmage based on what the defense is doing. Now is not the time to make a QB switch.

Changing plays at the line? They do all that from the sideline bub.... This isn't 1994. Don't you notice the entire team looking over there before the snap, every play?

Jalen only looks at 1 option every play (usually Ridley) so it's not exactly brain surgery.

Talking 2-3 series' with a handful of plays he's been well prepared to run... It doesn't have to be that complicated.

 

[TUSKtimes]

Daboll needs to pick it up as well. Coach Saban mentioned that he told the players this is what happens when you don't control what you can control. I hope he was talking to the coaching staff as well. The coaches can get way too conservative when they need to be more aggressive. In this case, it was definitely part of the problem.

Maybe this barner loss snaps everyone out of this funk.

 

[jdpas29]

I love Jalen, but there is nothing wrong with breaking out some different looks for a big game as CNS has done many times in the past. In this list of different looks should be included a lefty passer with the abilities that Tua has sitting on your bench. It's about winning, right?

I also think a stacked backfield with 2 RBs and Jalen running triple option or more read option with extra blockers would be a good go to power on power with Clempsum. Just to mix it up and make their LBs run more laterally early in the game... or late for that matter..

 

[Sgt. Lincoln Osiris]

Nothing, what I have against anything is every single time Jalen throws a bad pass we hear "Tua time!". Two QBs doesn't work for a NUMBER of reasons. Whether its one looking over his shoulder wondering if hes going to get benched for making a bad play or just simply neither one can get anything going because they're having to alternate. I guarantee if they put Tua in there and he performed like the true freshman he is, ya know considering he wont be playing against beaten down backups or third string defenders or Mercer, people would be screaming for him to be replaced. Jalen Hurts is the starting QB, Tua is the backup. I hope Tua is one the day the starter and lives up to all of the ridiculous, no way to ever come even close to getting to expectations fans have put on him but this is Jalen's team.

I seem to remember another Championship winning coach here at the Capstone say something like...

"If you have 2 quarterbacks, you have NONE."

 

[BamaFan334]

"If Tua performed like a true freshman..." You mean like Jalen did in Texas? Had we just stuck with Blake Barnett after a few bad series that technically weren't his fault, then what does Jalen ever accomplish?

You're pretending like there is something to lose offensively and there isn't. I like Hurts more than 75% of the posters on the board but when the offense sucks you need to try a few new things. When your QB doesn't step up in the pocket to make throws (as he was earlier in the season) you have to wonder if his confidence is shook.

There's nothing to lose here. Jalen "looking over his shoulder" maybe a good thing since he showed about 0 vocal leadership or outward fire in the Auburn game.

Nothing more than using a talented option on the bench to add production. We don't HAVE to use 3 RB's... But we do for the same reasons we should use Tua. Different skills, different looks, special talent can move the ball.

The offense sucks? Well you better be looking at the playcalling there, because you clearly see we did not run the ball NEAR as much as we should. Think I saw Damien averaging over eight a carry against Auburn, Bo over seven, and Jacobs almost five. So we had like 18 total rushes? Yeah, that's coaching, not Jalen Hurts. You diagnosis there is all hypothetical. You are talking as if you know Tua will be productive and that his skill set as a passer is ready for a mid-game insertion into the fire. Auburn is a hell of a lot different than Tennessee and Vanderbilt when he had a commanding lead. You can't just sling balls into the air in the Iron Bowl, because they will get picked. If I knew we had a series to burn, sure, I'd love to see Tua get in there and see what he could do, but Hurts has led a team for two years now with two freaking losses, and gave us the lead with a minute to spare in the national Championship game. Calling for his head at this point like a lot of folks are doing is beyond preposterous. It just shows no loyalty. I'm with @uagrad93 , if Coach Saban thought he was ready and could offer something, he would have been thrown out there.

Now, the vocal leadership you speak about is real. I do think Hurts lacks that during the game (no clue what he is like in practice, in meetings, and in the weight room). He seems so chill, it reminds me of Mark Richt, almost worse as he's motionless in the face. On a team that clearly needs a offensive vocal leader, I wish he would step in. Ridley is just quiet and goes to work, Damien Harris has the results and production to command it, but they freaking don't run his ass enough to be out there and be the voice, and the linemen seem to have their hands full every play to not be like a Barrett Jones or DJ Fluker type influence. I do agree though, as a quarterback he needs to speak up a hair.

 

[TUSKtimes]

I seem to remember another Championship winning coach here at the Capstone say something like...

"If you have 2 quarterbacks, you have NONE."

It wasn't coach Bryant. He played two QBs, two offensive lines, two everything, with very little drop off. Just the way the Tide rolled. For about a decade.

 

[Sgt. Lincoln Osiris]

It wasn't coach Bryant. He played two QBs, two offensive lines, two everything, with very little drop off. Just the way the Tide rolled. For about a decade.

In an era where QBs threw on average 6-8 passes a game, and where he could sign 30+ players a year just to keep them from playing for our rivals.

It was a more recent Champ coach...


And before someone says "Bu-but..2006 Tebow!" Tebow was primarily a situational battering ram, essentially a short yardage/goal line RB that maybe tossed 2-3 passes a game that year.

 

[jdpas29]

At least 2 of our RBs get better with the more carries they get and toward the end of the game. Against the last few opponents, there is little opportunity for that to take place as the coaching staff is asking Jalen hurts to be Tom Brady out there. It is silly...

Download the playbook from Lane's offense and run it against Clempsum. I know it hurts some feelings, but he did more with the talent on hand than and OC we've had in Saban's era IMO.

 

[50+yeartidefan]

It wasn't coach Bryant. He played two QBs, two offensive lines, two everything, with very little drop off. Just the way the Tide rolled. For about a decade.

Cause the 2a were as good as the 1s..lol
And the 2s were the 1s the next year.....
And guys in other post......get over it....JH is the 1...period....
Starter...finisher...and in the middle also

 

[TUSKtimes]

In an era where QBs threw on average 6-8 passes a game, and where he could sign 30+ players a year just to keep them from playing for our rivals.

It was a more recent Champ coach...

The year we won the NC in 92 Bama had one QB and at times during the season, we almost didn't have one. But that's another story.

And maybe Stallings can go into more detail why he felt the need to run Palmer in and out at the QB position.

 

[Sgt. Lincoln Osiris]

The year we won the NC in 92 Bama had one QB and at times during the season, we almost didn't have one. But that's another story.

And maybe Stallings can go into more detail why he felt the need to run Palmer in and out at the QB position.

Wildcat QB before it was sexy. Palmer threw what... Maybe 10-15 passes out of all of his snaps at 2nd RB (I mean...QB)? And those were just to break tendency and catch D's off guard.

 

['65 Cobra]

I don't understand why this topic elicits so much emotion. There is nothing wrong with raising rational thoughts. Jalen has many strengths, but he also has very real liabilities, some of which have not been improving. They are: he locks on to Ridley, he telegraphs his passes, he takes very bad sacks, he has no left side, and he has poor field vision too often missing open receivers. These weaknesses haven't improved much. Would it be horrible to develop a few plays or a series or two with Tua? I don't think so. Forcing the opposing defense to also have to defend the left side of the field on passes may have merit.

But there's more to it than just Jalen. All too often, a guy like Damien gets hot and he's pulled from the game rarely to be seen again. This is Dabol getting too cute and clever. Ride that hot runner and run the ball! Bring in Bo in the second half.

Also, recognize the speed on Clemson's D. The best way to neutralize that speed is to run right at them - not swing passes, sweeps, and slow-developing wide run plays. Pound the rock.

 

[TerryP]

In this list of different looks should be included a lefty passer with the abilities that Tua has sitting on your bench.

Let's go with this for a minute.

What different look(s) are we going to see if the team goes with the left handed QB? The scheme will remain the same. The formations will remain the same. Opposing corners still have to cover whether it's a right handed or left handed QB.

A bigger passing threat? OK, that's a given. But, it also means the team is losing a valuable running threat. In the case of Clemson, the Tide needs the ball and time of possession.

I think 2 QBs may work but Saban has not shown an affinity to that method yet

Not at Bama, but he did at LSU. As one example, in '04 he played Russell and Randall in every game.

He seems to believe in rhythm and confidence being the most important factors for QB success which is ironic because Jalen has really struggled with both.

Without knowing Jalen, or what's going on in his mind, saying he's lacking in confidence is merely a supposition.

Rhythm? Now you're onto a point.

Consider: Bama has WR and TE corps who are built for more of a spread attack. The OL, RB, and QB are built more from a pro-style running attack offense. That kind of mixture can easily lead to situations where it's hard for the QB, offense, or the offensive coordinator to get a rhythm.

 

[TUSKtimes]

Wildcat QB before it was sexy. Palmer threw what... Maybe 10-15 passes out of all of his snaps at 2nd RB (I mean...QB)? And those were just to break tendency and catch D's off guard.

And if you painfully remember Barker was struggling to throw the ball past the LOS his sophomore year. Stallings did what he had to do to create any kind of offense to win, or tie if you recall the tenn game.

I'm not suggesting anything needs to change this season, I think things will change somewhat next season. But if it does change now, coach Saban is more than capable of controlling the narrative, just as coach Bryant and Stallings chose to do.

 

[alagator]

• This season, according to data supplied by ProFootballFocus.com, 54 percent of his 194 pass attempts have traveled 10 or more yards in the air. Last season, through 11 weeks, only 35 percent of his passes covered that distance.
• In recent weeks, that means targeting players running extended routes. Only seven of his last 64 passes have been delivered to teammates lurking behind the line of scrimmage. The constant stream of screens and jet sweeps that was so prevalent with Daboll's predecessor, Lane Kiffin, in charge has dissipated to a trickle.
  
• At this point last season, only seven percent of Hurts' throws entered an area with horizontal dimensions between the numbers and vertical parameters of ten and 19 yards beyond the line of scrimmage. He completed only 57 percent of them for 193 yards with two interceptions.
  
• According to CFBfilmroom.com, one-third of his passes in 2016 were thrown to receivers running ten or more yards beyond the line of scrimmage. This year, that number has jumped to 54 percent.

But he hasn't improved.

 

[Robby Eversole]

If Saban didn't play Tua against Auburn, he is not playing him against Clemson.

 

[ColoradoTide]

I don't want Hurts replaced and I don't want QB-by-committee

But what I would like to see are some plays with both Hurts AND Tua in the backfield to give opposing defenses some things to worry about. I could see Hurts handing off to Tua then Hurts rolling out for a screen, stuff like that.

 

[Tidestalker]

The offense sucks? Well you better be looking at the playcalling there, because you clearly see we did not run the ball NEAR as much as we should. Think I saw Damien averaging over eight a carry against Auburn, Bo over seven, and Jacobs almost five. So we had like 18 total rushes? Yeah, that's coaching, not Jalen Hurts. You diagnosis there is all hypothetical. You are talking as if you know Tua will be productive and that his skill set as a passer is ready for a mid-game insertion into the fire. Auburn is a hell of a lot different than Tennessee and Vanderbilt when he had a commanding lead. You can't just sling balls into the air in the Iron Bowl, because they will get picked. If I knew we had a series to burn, sure, I'd love to see Tua get in there and see what he could do, but Hurts has led a team for two years now with two freaking losses, and gave us the lead with a minute to spare in the national Championship game. Calling for his head at this point like a lot of folks are doing is beyond preposterous. It just shows no loyalty. I'm with @uagrad93 , if Coach Saban thought he was ready and could offer something, he would have been thrown out there.

Now, the vocal leadership you speak about is real. I do think Hurts lacks that during the game (no clue what he is like in practice, in meetings, and in the weight room). He seems so chill, it reminds me of Mark Richt, almost worse as he's motionless in the face. On a team that clearly needs a offensive vocal leader, I wish he would step in. Ridley is just quiet and goes to work, Damien Harris has the results and production to command it, but they freaking don't run his ass enough to be out there and be the voice, and the linemen seem to have their hands full every play to not be like a Barrett Jones or DJ Fluker type influence. I do agree though, as a quarterback he needs to speak up a hair.

I agree the play calling has sucked.

I also think it's tough to call plays with a QB that can only make 1 read. You literally have to call the perfect play for that defense because there is no 2nd "passing" option.

I think you're missing the point about what Jalen has accomplished at Alabama. A warm body could win at least 10/12 of the game Alabama has scheduled the last 2 seasons. And those 2 losses have come with everything (at the time) on the line.

The butthurt for any type of change to a painfully inconsistent offense in the biggest moments is confusing. Not changing ANYTHING is crazy. If it was up to me, the QB wouldn't matter because we'd run the ball 40 times a game... With the RB's... Not called pass plays that end in runs (to the right usually). But Daboll isn't going anywhere.

So if we are going to run a lot of pass plays why not use a QB that has potential to be a great passer? Jalen has potential to be a good passer... He's not a bad QB. But the offense has looked bad.

It's really not that complicated. It's just using the talent on the roster instead of putting your head in the sand.