| FTBL Bama's Mount Rushmore

[BamaFan334]

I like AJ and there's an argument there, but to say Julio didn't live up to his billing is one of the most assnine things I've ever heard. The dude is the best receiver to ever play at Alabama, but set aside the receiving records if you want and you still got one of the best blocking WRs in the country during his time and he loved it! Please name one person that accomplished what he did. AJ Green was a damn good WR, but he didn't block at all worth a damn. Plenty of others went above and beyond their ceilings? None of them had the expectations that Julio did, so they don't compare if they went above and beyond their ceilings then they didn't start that way whereas Julio came to school with the ceiling those other dudes finished with.

I say he didn't live up to the billing of a five star because his stats just don't offer that status to me, but I also want to say that most five star receivers don't.. He meant a lot to the team, but he just didn't showcase as much talent on the field that I knew he had. Calvin Johnson, Demarius Thomas, Michael Crabtree, Marquis Lee, and I could name plenty of others that didn't have great quarterbacks throwing to them, yet they have the stats to back up my argument. Hell, even Amari Cooper has had a better career thus far than Julio based on a statistical prospective. He will be holding all the records before he leaves, especially if he gets a quarterback this year that can get him the ball. I'm going to say it again, I love Julio Jones and he is a physical stud, but his years at Alabama do not put him above AJ McCarron on who belongs on a Mount Rushmore scenario.

And for the guy that said he would take Julio over AJ Green any day, may want to rethink that one. Personally, I don't think you can go wrong, but AJ is way more fluid than the more physical Julio. So I guess it's whomever your team is is who you'll pick there.

 

[BamaFan334]

I stand corrected, he did have a thousand yard season in 2010 it says. Not sure what the heck I was looking at before, so I apologize for my oversight. His stats are better than I initially saw, so now I feel like a big idiot, but I still hold firm on the belief that he only scraped his potential at Alabama. I also stand by AJ McCarron being ahead of him in that discussion.

 

[bamaraider]

I'd like to see what Julio could have done with AJ at QB.

 

[JoshB]

How can you argue that he didnt live up to his potential and start throwing around stats yet dont know that he broke the single season receptions and yardage record...

and all the stupid stat talk is what kills me, thats the Skip Bayless syndrome... stats do not tell the whole story especially for a receiver in our type of offense and just saying that all you're gonna look at is stats is ridiculous, especially when you obviously dont know what the actual stats are...

Again you wanna argue AJ McCarron would deserve that distinction more, thats fine and very arguable but to suggest that Julio didnt live up to his hype is insane.

 

[DT55]

How can you argue that he didnt live up to his potential and start throwing around stats yet dont know that he broke the single season receptions and yardage record...

and all the stupid stat talk is what kills me, thats the Skip Bayless syndrome... stats do not tell the whole story especially for a receiver in our type of offense and just saying that all you're gonna look at is stats is ridiculous, especially when you obviously dont know what the actual stats are...

Again you wanna argue AJ McCarron would deserve that distinction more, thats fine and very arguable but to suggest that Julio didnt live up to his hype is insane.

Indeed. Completely agree.

Anybody with two eyeballs knows Julio's importance and influence on our program.

 

[ElephantStomp]

I'll tell you that I'd take Julio any day over AJ Green

Me too. Hands down.

 

[ElephantStomp]

I like AJ and there's an argument there, but to say Julio didn't live up to his billing is one of the most assnine things I've ever heard. The dude is the best receiver to ever play at Alabama, but set aside the receiving records if you want and you still got one of the best blocking WRs in the country during his time and he loved it! Please name one person that accomplished what he did. AJ Green was a damn good WR, but he didn't block at all worth a damn. Plenty of others went above and beyond their ceilings? None of them had the expectations that Julio did, so they don't compare if they went above and beyond their ceilings then they didn't start that way whereas Julio came to school with the ceiling those other dudes finished with.

I say he didn't live up to the billing of a five star because his stats just don't offer that status to me, but I also want to say that most five star receivers don't.. He meant a lot to the team, but he just didn't showcase as much talent on the field that I knew he had. Calvin Johnson, Demarius Thomas, Michael Crabtree, Marquis Lee, and I could name plenty of others that didn't have great quarterbacks throwing to them, yet they have the stats to back up my argument. Hell, even Amari Cooper has had a better career thus far than Julio based on a statistical prospective. He will be holding all the records before he leaves, especially if he gets a quarterback this year that can get him the ball. I'm going to say it again, I love Julio Jones and he is a physical stud, but his years at Alabama do not put him above AJ McCarron on who belongs on a Mount Rushmore scenario.

And for the guy that said he would take Julio over AJ Green any day, may want to rethink that one. Personally, I don't think you can go wrong, but AJ is way more fluid than the more physical Julio. So I guess it's whomever your team is is who you'll pick there.

All those other WRs including Amari (who is my favorite player on the team) didn't play on an offense with Ingram and Richardson. If Julio played on a team that didn't feature those two he would've had a 2,000 yard season.

 

[mrchase]

I say he didn't live up to the billing of a five star because his stats just don't offer that status to me, but I also want to say that most five star receivers don't.. He meant a lot to the team, but he just didn't showcase as much talent on the field that I knew he had. Calvin Johnson, Demarius Thomas, Michael Crabtree, Marquis Lee, and I could name plenty of others that didn't have great quarterbacks throwing to them, yet they have the stats to back up my argument. Hell, even Amari Cooper has had a better career thus far than Julio based on a statistical prospective. He will be holding all the records before he leaves, especially if he gets a quarterback this year that can get him the ball. I'm going to say it again, I love Julio Jones and he is a physical stud, but his years at Alabama do not put him above AJ McCarron on who belongs on a Mount Rushmore scenario.

And for the guy that said he would take Julio over AJ Green any day, may want to rethink that one. Personally, I don't think you can go wrong, but AJ is way more fluid than the more physical Julio. So I guess it's whomever your team is is who you'll pick there.

Rethunk it, And STILL would take Julio. Julio brings more to the table for me. But hey thats just me. When Julio was here the offense wasn't as "open" as it was/is with Amari. But Julio still produced. And not only in receptions and yardage. Julio is more mature than Green (in my opinion).....

Now when you named those other WR's that didn't have great QB's throwing to them....... I'll take Crabtree to use in this example
This is from 2008

PASSING STATISTICS
NAME	CMP	ATT	YDS	CMP%	YDS/A	TD	INT	RAT
John Parker Wilson	186	321	2243	57.9	6.99	9	7	121.5

<tbody>
</tbody>

PASSING STATISTICS
NAME	CMP	ATT	YDS	CMP%	YDS/A	TD	INT	RAT
Graham Harrell	442	626	5111	70.6	8.17	45	9	160.0

<tbody>
</tbody>

Sooooooo what were you saying about the QB? (not calling Harrell great, but imagine Julio in a system that threw that much)

 

[mrchase]

And the 2008 season we were a play or 2 from being in the national championship instead of Florida. Outside of Calvin Johnson, Julio is the best WR in the group you named

 

[It Takes Eleven]

I'm sitting in Pittsburgh, realizing how futile it is to pick four figures from the annals of Tide football history. So, I decided to go by general position.

Coaches: Wade, Thomas, Bryant, Saban (the only four multiple NC coaches)

QBs: Gilmer, Namath, Barker, AJ (Trammell and Stabler are tough to leave off)

Receivers: Hutson, Homan, Newsome, Julio (Palmer is close)

RBs: Shaun Alexander, Johnny Davis, Humphrey and Trent (hard to leave off Bobby Marlow, Musso, Tony Nathan, Ingram and Lacy)

OL: Hannah, Stephenson, Samuels, Jones

DL: Lyons, Cody, Hand, Baumhower

DE: Thomas, E.J. Junior, Leroy Cook, Copeland (Thomas made more big plays with his hand in the dirt as a rush end)

LB: Jordan, Woodrow Lowe, Bennett, Thomas Boyd (Demeco, CJ are close)

S: Wilcox, Kevin Jackson, Barron, Rashad

CB: Castille, Teague, Langham, Townsend

K: Tiffin, Doyle, Proctor, Tiffin

P: Gantt, Mohr, Bearden, Mandell

 

[BamaFan334]

Rethunk it, And STILL would take Julio. Julio brings more to the table for me. But hey thats just me. When Julio was here the offense wasn't as "open" as it was/is with Amari. But Julio still produced. And not only in receptions and yardage. Julio is more mature than Green (in my opinion).....

Now when you named those other WR's that didn't have great QB's throwing to them....... I'll take Crabtree to use in this example
This is from 2008

PASSING STATISTICS
NAME	CMP	ATT	YDS	CMP%	YDS/A	TD	INT	RAT
John Parker Wilson	186	321	2243	57.9	6.99	9	7	121.5

<TBODY>
</TBODY>

PASSING STATISTICS
NAME	CMP	ATT	YDS	CMP%	YDS/A	TD	INT	RAT
Graham Harrell	442	626	5111	70.6	8.17	45	9	160.0

<TBODY>
</TBODY>

Sooooooo what were you saying about the QB? (not calling Harrell great, but imagine Julio in a system that threw that much)

This is exactly why I almost didn't say Crabtree because of the offense he was in, but I used him anyways just to say a few recent names that went above and beyonf their ceiling, even with hype out of high school.

 

[BamaFan334]

How can you argue that he didnt live up to his potential and start throwing around stats yet dont know that he broke the single season receptions and yardage record...

and all the stupid stat talk is what kills me, thats the Skip Bayless syndrome... stats do not tell the whole story especially for a receiver in our type of offense and just saying that all you're gonna look at is stats is ridiculous, especially when you obviously dont know what the actual stats are...

Again you wanna argue AJ McCarron would deserve that distinction more, thats fine and very arguable but to suggest that Julio didnt live up to his hype is insane.

Believe me, I know there is more to the game than statistics, and I accounted for that, but the way he was recruited and the way he was spoken about you would have thought he would have had three thousand yard seasons with ten touchdowns each season. And don't give me that crap about I don't know what I'm talking about because I'm being impartial in my comments, whereas everyone else is speaking from the heart. Here, take a look...

http://athlonsports.com/college-football/college-footballs-top-50-wide-receivers-bcs-era

I mispoke about his stats because I was looking and comparing so many that I slipped up, my bad, yes, but don't call me stupid because I gaurantee I know football just as good as everyone on here. He was pretty darn good, and I am so very happy my Atlanta Falcons drafted him, but I still don't believe he lived up to the five star hype. Very few five stars do. I don't think AJ Green did, not do I think Matthew Stafford and other high draft picks like them did. If I'm not mistaken, he was never voted an All-American either. I think people on here are taking this as I don't think he was any good and he was garbage, which is false. I think he was a tremendous player, and I love hearing the stories about him, but I just don't believe he lived up to the hype and I don't think he'll be the best receiver once Amari Cooper leaves.

 

[BamaFan334]

All those other WRs including Amari (who is my favorite player on the team) didn't play on an offense with Ingram and Richardson. If Julio played on a team that didn't feature those two he would've had a 2,000 yard season.

Alabama has Yeldon, Drake, and Henry now, and had Lacy and Yeldon last year, so yes Cooper has had that influence of the running game to compete with. Alabama threw the ball just as much these last few years as they did when Julio was around, I looked it up. Yeldon and Lacy and Yeldon and Drake both duos had around the same amount of carries as Coffee and Ingram, Ingram and Richardson, and Richardson and Lacy.

 

[bama alum]

I'll tell you that I'd take Julio any day over AJ Green

So would I. My RB choices can be a coin flip of either Shaun Alexander or Trent Richardson.

 

[mrchase]

Believe me, I know there is more to the game than statistics, and I accounted for that, but the way he was recruited and the way he was spoken about you would have thought he would have had three thousand yard seasons with ten touchdowns each season. And don't give me that crap about I don't know what I'm talking about because I'm being impartial in my comments, whereas everyone else is speaking from the heart. Here, take a look...

http://athlonsports.com/college-football/college-footballs-top-50-wide-receivers-bcs-era

I mispoke about his stats because I was looking and comparing so many that I slipped up, my bad, yes, but don't call me stupid because I gaurantee I know football just as good as everyone on here. He was pretty darn good, and I am so very happy my Atlanta Falcons drafted him, but I still don't believe he lived up to the five star hype. Very few five stars do. I don't think AJ Green did, not do I think Matthew Stafford and other high draft picks like them did. If I'm not mistaken, he was never voted an All-American either. I think people on here are taking this as I don't think he was any good and he was garbage, which is false. I think he was a tremendous player, and I love hearing the stories about him, but I just don't believe he lived up to the hype and I don't think he'll be the best receiver once Amari Cooper leaves.

I sort of understand where you are coming from, but with all that said Julio is still a more complete WR. And by complete i mean being able to play whatever role is needed for him that day....... Possession, Deep Threat, Blocking, etc.... I think he lived up to and beyond what was expected. Now in my opinion, a name that comes to mind that hasn't lived up to expectations when it comes to WR is Dorial Green Beckam (spelling)........

Question.....you said that AJ Green was/is more fluid.....which i would agree. But isn't he more fluid than Calvin Johnson also?

 

[bama alum]

Mr. Chase, you know...I think I'd like to see one of your edits of a Bama Mt. Rushmore.

 

[JoshB]

Believe me, I know there is more to the game than statistics, and I accounted for that, but the way he was recruited and the way he was spoken about you would have thought he would have had three thousand yard seasons with ten touchdowns each season. And don't give me that crap about I don't know what I'm talking about because I'm being impartial in my comments, whereas everyone else is speaking from the heart. Here, take a look...

http://athlonsports.com/college-football/college-footballs-top-50-wide-receivers-bcs-era

I mispoke about his stats because I was looking and comparing so many that I slipped up, my bad, yes, but don't call me stupid because I gaurantee I know football just as good as everyone on here. He was pretty darn good, and I am so very happy my Atlanta Falcons drafted him, but I still don't believe he lived up to the five star hype. Very few five stars do. I don't think AJ Green did, not do I think Matthew Stafford and other high draft picks like them did. If I'm not mistaken, he was never voted an All-American either. I think people on here are taking this as I don't think he was any good and he was garbage, which is false. I think he was a tremendous player, and I love hearing the stories about him, but I just don't believe he lived up to the hype and I don't think he'll be the best receiver once Amari Cooper leaves.

Okay, first off I never called you stupid so you're putting words in my mouth and being very defensive over something I never said...

Second the only thing you even argued was statistics so how am to gauge what you do and dont understand? Now you say you understand there is more than stats and you know Julio brought much more to the table than stats yet you still argue he didnt reach his potential. But then you'll turn right around and compare him to Michael Crabtree and claim that Crabtree reached his full potential despite some massive buzz except Crabtree didnt have 1/10th the buzz or expectations on him that Julio does, he wasnt even a five star like you keep throwing out there...

This is the last time Im gonna comment on this because obviously noone is getting thru to you... Im not speaking from the heart, Im speaking from what my eyeballs told me. In fact go ask Nick Saban what one player from any team he would like to have more than any on the team right now, 99% sure he would say Julio and its not just because of his catches or TDs...

And you're making me feel like I gotta tear Amari Cooper down because of the claim that he is "better" than Julio. He's a better route runner, thats about as far as I would go but hes a terrific player thats just gonna get better so I hate to even have to make that comparison.

 

[mrchase]

Mr. Chase, you know...I think I'd like to see one of your edits of a Bama Mt. Rushmore.

I'll work on one tonight after work...... It's hard for me to pick but I'll do my best

 

[BamaFan334]

Okay, first off I never called you stupid so you're putting words in my mouth and being very defensive over something I never said...

Second the only thing you even argued was statistics so how am to gauge what you do and dont understand? Now you say you understand there is more than stats and you know Julio brought much more to the table than stats yet you still argue he didnt reach his potential. But then you'll turn right around and compare him to Michael Crabtree and claim that Crabtree reached his full potential despite some massive buzz except Crabtree didnt have 1/10th the buzz or expectations on him that Julio does, he wasnt even a five star like you keep throwing out there...

This is the last time Im gonna comment on this because obviously noone is getting thru to you... Im not speaking from the heart, Im speaking from what my eyeballs told me. In fact go ask Nick Saban what one player from any team he would like to have more than any on the team right now, 99% sure he would say Julio and its not just because of his catches or TDs...

And you're making me feel like I gotta tear Amari Cooper down because of the claim that he is "better" than Julio. He's a better route runner, thats about as far as I would go but hes a terrific player thats just gonna get better so I hate to even have to make that comparison.

I didn't quote you as calling me stupid or I would have used quotation marks, I was stating the way you were commenting you made it seem like I was dumb for saying what I said.

As far as the Crabtree part, he was a four star recruit that came in with some hype, and he performed at a level of five star relevance. I didn't say that any of those receivers came in with Julio hype, but that they came in with some buzz and exceeded the expectations by far. The link I posted for you was Athlons list of best BCS receivers, so there are about twenty others they placed ahead of Julio.

It's not an idea of getting through to me, because it's your opinion. This whole Mount Rushmore blog is opinion. The fact that he meant so much more to the team than stats is an opinion, because there is no way to gauge that. Kevin Norwood is right there with Julio Jones if you want to say that it is more than stats. I love Kevin Norwood, he always stepped up in big games, was a leader, and was clutch for the team. Are you willing to put him alongside Julio for what he meant to the team and what he accomplished on the field? I'm sure Coach Saban would give Julio Jones a good endorsement, what coach wouldn't say those things about any player?

Is Cooper faster than Julio was? He definitely looks it, and he has more moves than Julio, but of course he is smaller and not as bulky. I'm wasn't trying to get you to tear into him, I just wanted him to get some recognition for what he brings to the team. If he were healthy last year, our offense would have hummed a little better. He can break one any time he touches the ball, against any and all competition. Julio could and can too, but I think Cooper will take his receiving records over next year.

 

[It Takes Eleven]

I didn't quote you as calling me stupid or I would have used quotation marks, I was stating the way you were commenting you made it seem like I was dumb for saying what I said.

As far as the Crabtree part, he was a four star recruit that came in with some hype, and he performed at a level of five star relevance. I didn't say that any of those receivers came in with Julio hype, but that they came in with some buzz and exceeded the expectations by far. The link I posted for you was Athlons list of best BCS receivers, so there are about twenty others they placed ahead of Julio.

It's not an idea of getting through to me, because it's your opinion. This whole Mount Rushmore blog is opinion. The fact that he meant so much more to the team than stats is an opinion, because there is no way to gauge that. Kevin Norwood is right there with Julio Jones if you want to say that it is more than stats. I love Kevin Norwood, he always stepped up in big games, was a leader, and was clutch for the team. Are you willing to put him alongside Julio for what he meant to the team and what he accomplished on the field? I'm sure Coach Saban would give Julio Jones a good endorsement, what coach wouldn't say those things about any player?

Is Cooper faster than Julio was? He definitely looks it, and he has more moves than Julio, but of course he is smaller and not as bulky. I'm wasn't trying to get you to tear into him, I just wanted him to get some recognition for what he brings to the team. If he were healthy last year, our offense would have hummed a little better. He can break one any time he touches the ball, against any and all competition. Julio could and can too, but I think Cooper will take his receiving records over next year.

The only thing I'll say about Julio that sets him apart from the other two wonderful Bama receivers you mention is that he continued to have really good numbers while he was hurt - after rib injuries fighting for extra yards against LSU, after having a steel pin surgically implanted in his broken hand and not missing the next game, continuing to be a devastating blocker.

We'll never be able to definitively say who was the best, particularly if they didn't play with the same supporting cast, run the same scheme or play in the same era. That's what makes this conversation fun, and frustrating, at the same time.

Take a look at the Bama record book, for example, and examine year by year passing leaders. Harry Gilmer was the first QB to attempt over 100 passes in a season. That was 1946. A Bama QB didn't attempt 200 passes until Scott Hunter in 1968 and 1969. The 200 attempt level wasn't reached again until Walter Lewis in 1983. Hollingsworth broke 300, attempting 339 in 1989, and since Croyle's 2005 campaign we've had a QB chunking it over 300 times a seasons. JPW in 2007 attempted 462 passes.

Does this mean that every newer QB is better than those in the past? Of course not, it's scheme, necessity and era. We couldn't run the ball in 2007. Heck, Richard Todd only attempted 89 passes as a senior in 1975, went and wowed them at the Senior Bowl (or Blue-Gray) and he became the Jets' QB. Hunter broke the season passing record in 69. He's now out of the top 10. Hollingsworth broke it in 89 - he's now tenth.

It's all the same game, and all different. That's what makes it interesting.

RTR,

Tim