🏈 A-Day In Review.

[Tidestalker]

Dieter might have been a bit of a liability in the passing game, even though he finished with 5-6 TD catches, but you saw him drive blocking guys into the damn fence. He did struggle at the point of attack, the bubble screens, but it was on down the field blocks that Dieter and Stewart really worked some guys over.

That was a good block. "A bit of a liability" the key words in your statement though

 

[UAgrad93]

That was a good block. "A bit of a liability" the key words in your statement though

15 catches 200+ yards 4 TDs. That was good for 4th in receiving catches and yards!! Kiffin's style was to showcase one guy, 2 at most, thus Ridley and Stewart were the go to guys, and OJ was the 3rd option. I think Daboll will look to utilize all options and spread the wealth. While I did say Dieter may have been "a bit of a liability" in the passing game. It isn't like he dropped 6-8 balls every game and didn't block a soul on the edge ever.

 

[Tidestalker]

15 catches 200+ yards 4 TDs. That was good for 4th in receiving catches and yards!! Kiffin's style was to showcase one guy, 2 at most, thus Ridley and Stewart were the go to guys, and OJ was the 3rd option. I think Daboll will look to utilize all options and spread the wealth. While I did say Dieter may have been "a bit of a liability" in the passing game. It isn't like he dropped 6-8 balls every game and didn't block a soul on the edge ever.

Of course he didn't drop 6-8 balls every game because he was rarely targeted. Many of the 15 catches he had were in blow outs anyway... And as far as drops, by %, I can't remember a guy who dropped more balls thrown in his direction with Saban. As far as his blocking, he probably had a few good ones. Bubble screens, which was half our offense, was a debacle for him.

You're making my point for me... In trying to point out that needing 5-6 WR's is important, you've pointed out that the 3rd WR caught 15 passes last year. We will have solid TE's and more RB receptions. Remember that when the #5 dude is in, Ridley/Foster/Jeudy isn't. I agree that Kiffin targeted on specific dudes but it's always been that way regardless of OC, because they're always going to have studs on the field for the big plays. No one can seriously tell me a #5 receiver that was a difference maker at Alabama, that won't change this year either barring serious injuries.

 

[UAgrad93]

Of course he didn't drop 6-8 balls every game because he was rarely targeted. Many of the 15 catches he had were in blow outs anyway... And as far as drops, by %, I can't remember a guy who dropped more balls thrown in his direction with Saban. As far as his blocking, he probably had a few good ones. Bubble screens, which was half our offense, was a debacle for him.

You're making my point for me... In trying to point out that needing 5-6 WR's is important, you've pointed out that the 3rd WR caught 15 passes last year. We will have solid TE's and more RB receptions. Remember that when the #5 dude is in, Ridley/Foster/Jeudy isn't. I agree that Kiffin targeted on specific dudes but it's always been that way regardless of OC, because they're always going to have studs on the field for the big plays. No one can seriously tell me a #5 receiver that was a difference maker at Alabama, that won't change this year either barring serious injuries.

Go back and watch Stewart early in his career. He dropped quite a few balls. As far as Dieter being a debacle on bubble screens, he struggled early on, but without going back and watching every single series, I think he and Kiffin made adjustments from time to time. Dieter improved and Kiffin called the bubble screens using the TE spread out. Using Dieter's stats from last season wasn't meant to prove your point. It was to show you where he was ranked. I could have left out the stats and let you look it up, but IT IS important to have more than just Ridley, Jeudy, and Foster on the field.
Think for a second, when OJ was young, everyone bitched about his lack of production but him having amazing skill as a receiver. @TerryP and myself, along with a few others said, "because he is a liability as a blocker, EVERYONE knows it's a pass when OJ comes in." Now fast forward to having capable WRs on the edge. They have to be able to block when we aren't putting the ball in the air. Dieter was one of our better WRs when it came to blocking. People wondered why Foster was pretty much non existent last season, attitude and a lack of effort in blocking. You can't think it is beneath you. Hopefully, his attitude has changed.
We will likely disagree on all of this but at least we can agree on this, "We have a helluva lot of talent at the WR position and RB position and even the TE position and Daboll will have his hands full trying to keep them all pleased."
Roll Tide!!

 

[TerryP]

Many of the 15 catches he had were in blow outs anyway...

13 of the 15 games last year were blow-outs and that's still not describing his season accurately.

There are far too many factors with last season involved with Dieter. You're the first I've seen complain about his blocking. Sure, I saw him miss some but that's no different than other guys on offense.

I suspect the expectation Dieter would put up bigger numbers due to his time at Bowling Green made last years results seem pedestrian, at best. I don't think it's fair to judge what he did in receptions due to the "Read #1, Read #2, Run" type of philosophy Kiffin had Jalen operating under. Serioulsy, how often did he find himself as the first or second read in the offense last season?

 

[Sgt. Lincoln Osiris]

13 of the 15 games last year were blow-outs and that's still not describing his season accurately.

There are far too many factors with last season involved with Dieter. You're the first I've seen complain about his blocking. Sure, I saw him miss some but that's no different than other guys on offense.

I suspect the expectation Dieter would put up bigger numbers due to his time at Bowling Green made last years results seem pedestrian, at best. I don't think it's fair to judge what he did in receptions due to the "Read #1, Read #2, Run" type of philosophy Kiffin had Jalen operating under. Serioulsy, how often did he find himself as the first or second read in the offense last season?

He missed less blocks than CamRob.

 

[TUSKtimes]

Very importantly, Dieter had a great pro-day. He was running sophisticated pass routes he was more familiar with at Bowling Green. He lined up in the slot and out wide and brought his old QB in for the trial to throw. By all accounts, he was a hit and with 4.5 speed he will get a good look. I doubt that any two players paid a higher price stat-wise for the offensive make up last season than Dieter and Ridley.

 

[TerryP]

He missed less blocks than CamRob.

That's not something I really wanted to think about this morning, SLO.

Here's a little something to ponder ...

Jalen's passing numbers are misleading because there were so many passes at, or behind, the line of scrimmage, right? I mean, this IS the narrative we're seeing, right?

Bama had success with those plays, with Ridley and Stewart, this past season.

So, as those two were adding to their YAC totals, anyone have any idea where Dieter was during all of this?
(We'll pause for a moment for a pondering time out...)
Yep. That's exactly where he was ...

 

[Sgt. Lincoln Osiris]

That's not something I really wanted to think about this morning, SLO.

Here's a little something to ponder ...

Jalen's passing numbers are misleading because there were so many passes at, or behind, the line of scrimmage, right? I mean, this IS the narrative we're seeing, right?

Bama had success with those plays, with Ridley and Stewart, this past season.

So, as those two were adding to their YAC totals, anyone have any idea where Dieter was during all of this?
(We'll pause for a moment for a pondering time out...)
Yep. That's exactly where he was ...

Putting a DB's dick in the dirt, that's where he was.

 

[Tidestalker]

Serioulsy, how often did he find himself as the first or second read in the offense last season?

By design.

 

[TerryP]

By design.

That's the point. More often than not, he was the third read (and the vast majority of the time that was a read in an area of the field they were avoiding--the middle.) A read, "by design," Jalen never made it to unless there wasn't any pressure, right?

It's my opinion if we could flip the years that Dieter and Mullaney played we'd find the numbers the same. It's arguable if Dieter would have played in '15 he would have had more receptions than Mullaney. That's speculation, but I believe it's arguable.

 

[Tidestalker]

That's the point. More often than not, he was the third read (and the vast majority of the time that was a read in an area of the field they were avoiding--the middle.) A read, "by design," Jalen never made it to unless there wasn't any pressure, right?

It's my opinion if we could flip the years that Dieter and Mullaney played we'd find the numbers the same. It's arguable if Dieter would have played in '15 he would have had more receptions than Mullaney. That's speculation, but I believe it's arguable.

Huh?!

You can argue whatever you'd like man... But the facts don't change.

Mullaney made some tough catches under pressure. He was the definition of dependable. Dieter made no (positive) impact on that season, with the same OC calling plays for both.

I'm blown away by this one

 

[TerryP]

Mullaney made some tough catches under pressure. He was the definition of dependable. Dieter made no (positive) impact on that season, with the same OC calling plays for both.

With two different quarterbacks, Stalker. Put Dieter with Coker, Mullaney with Jalen, and you're talking two different--drastically different--approaches on offense.

Dieter made no positive impact the season? SMH. That's a load, beau. A load.

 

[alagator]

Mullaney made some tough catches under pressure. He was the definition of dependable. Dieter made no (positive) impact on that season, with the same OC calling plays for both.

That's one of the more uninformed things I've read, anywhere. (You have to be replying JUST to be argumentative. You've proven you aren't this clueless when it comes to football.)

There's not a soul on this earth who will disagree with the majority of the yards the receivers had in '16 were from yards after the catch. Who is blocking on those passes that were at the line, or behind the line? Dieter.

If he wasn't having a positive impact on the team he wouldn't have been on the field.

 

[Tidestalker]

That's one of the more uninformed things I've read, anywhere. (You have to be replying JUST to be argumentative. You've proven you aren't this clueless when it comes to football.)

There's not a soul on this earth who will disagree with the majority of the yards the receivers had in '16 were from yards after the catch. Who is blocking on those passes that were at the line, or behind the line? Dieter.

If he wasn't having a positive impact on the team he wouldn't have been on the field.

I'll give you this - Dieter did make some positive impacts. The point I should have clarified is that it was no more valuable than any other scholarshiped WR on the roster could have done, and likely less judging by the drops. Yes, he did block or get in the way of some defenders while Ridley/Stewart/Harris ran to the end zone. He also missed some blocks. In no way would I believe that a healthy Cam Sims/Kief could not have done the same.

Now - As far as arguing to argue. How do you read Terry's posts in this thread, with any objectivity, and not accuse him of such? He's arguing that a player with almost 3X less catches, and half the yards, would have out produced the player that played behind the same 2 WR's, with the same OC, and another first year starter QB the year after?

It's arguable if Dieter would have played in '15 he would have had more receptions than Mullaney. That's speculation, but I believe it's arguable.

Someone is arguing to argue... Got that part right.

After stating that after the first 4 WR's, the rotation is basically meaningless, Terry and others go on to express how our #3 caught all of 14 passes last season yet #5/#6 need to be used as more than decoys this year. Huh? IT NEVER HAPPENS. And you can't tell me when it has under Saban. That is reality. #5/#6 will get mop up snaps at best... The others eat up almost all meaningful production.

 

[TerryP]

In no way would I believe that a healthy Cam Sims/Kief could not have done the same.

If that were the case, they would have started. Cam played in every game last season except Western Kentucky. There was a reason he didn't start over Dieter--Dieter game Bama the best chance to win, ergo, he was better at his responsibilities than Cam. Kief is no different.

You can add the disclaimer "healthy" if you like but it doesn't make it anymore true. Both played all year.

Now - As far as arguing to argue. How do you read Terry's posts in this thread, with any objectivity, and not accuse him of such? He's arguing that a player with almost 3X less catches, and half the yards, would have out produced the player that played behind the same 2 WR's, with the same OC, and another first year starter QB the year after?

Dude. One, with a 5th year senior. The other, with a true freshman. He's right. You know he's right.

We know the staff didn't have Jalen moving past (in his reads) one side of the field which essentially eliminated the slot as a third read. That was not the case with Coker.

 

[TerryP]

Someone is arguing to argue... Got that part right.

After stating that after the first 4 WR's, the rotation is basically meaningless, Terry and others go on to express how our #3 caught all of 14 passes last season yet #5/#6 need to be used as more than decoys this year. Huh? IT NEVER HAPPENS. And you can't tell me when it has under Saban. That is reality. #5/#6 will get mop up snaps at best... The others eat up almost all meaningful production.

I've never used the word decoy. I've never suggested the reason I wanted a two deep rotation was due to decoys.

I've never stated after the first four WR's the rotation is meaningless. I've never even entertained the notion--it's asinine.

 

[Tidestalker]

What I envision (otherwise known as want) is having a solid two-deep rotation for all three receiving positions. I don't want a defensive back looking at a WR, who's come on the field to spell one of the starters, as a pure blocker. Or, even worse, as a guy that isn't an option for the quarterback. )

I've never used the word decoy. I've never suggested the reason I wanted a two deep rotation was due to decoys.

I've never stated after the first four WR's the rotation is meaningless. I've never even entertained the notion--it's asinine.

I stated after the first 4 WR's the rotation is meaningless... Your rebuttal:

What I envision (otherwise known as want) is having a solid two-deep rotation for all three receiving positions. I don't want a defensive back looking at a WR, who's come on the field to spell one of the starters, as a pure blocker. Or, even worse, as a guy that isn't an option for the quarterback. )

Which is exactly what happens... If 5/6 ever get in. Which they rarely do. Sh*t even #3 was a pure blocker last year.

 

[TerryP]

Which is exactly what happens... If 5/6 ever get in.... If 5/6 ever get in. Which they rarely do. Sh*t even #3 was a pure blocker last year.

Simply not true. The only game Sims wasn't in the rotation was Western Kentucky. Kief was in the rotation 12 of the 15 games last year. Diggs was in the rotation at WR in every game last year as was Dieter, Stewart, and Ridley.

 

[Tidestalker]

Simply not true. The only game Sims wasn't in the rotation was Western Kentucky. Kief was in the rotation 12 of the 15 games last year. Diggs was in the rotation at WR in every game last year as was Dieter, Stewart, and Ridley.

#4 Sims - 14 Rec - 152 yards
--------------------------------------------------
#5 Diggs - 11 Rec - 88 yards
#6 Keif - 4 rec - 31 yards

Shit I guess you're right, Diggs damn near out produced Deter. Big time #'s! :rolf: