📡 Why Tua Tagovailoa is in the best position to 'win the team' at Alabama

[Rainer Sabin | rsabin@al.com]

Alabama coach Nick Saban said the quarterback who wins the team will be the starter. Tua Tagovailoa has the best shot to do that, in part, because he was part of a special recruiting class.

Why Tua Tagovailoa is in the best position to 'win the team' at Alabama

 

[Sgt. Lincoln Osiris]

Aside from @BamaBoyJosh, I think I may have been the biggest Jalen supporter up until now. I'm still of the wait-and-see how he does with a dedicated QB coach that actually PLAYED QB mindset. But I gotta say-the disparity among receiver distribution, historically, lends to Jalen's 1st read then run mentality argument.

If ENOS hasn't been able to fix that, then Jalen may be a lost cause in that regard. We'll know within the 1st couple of drives when both play. If Jalen repeatedly continues to drift to his right after his 1st read is covered in his 1st couple of series , then I feel we need to nail the coffin shut and name Tua the rest of the season.

 

[bama alum]

Aside from @BamaBoyJosh, I think I may have been the biggest Jalen supporter up until now. I'm still of the wait-and-see how he does with a dedicated QB coach that actually PLAYED QB mindset. But I gotta say-the disparity among receiver distribution, historically, lends to Jalen's 1st read then run mentality argument.

If ENOS hasn't been able to fix that, then Jalen may be a lost cause in that regard. We'll know within the 1st couple of drives when both play. If Jalen repeatedly continues to drift to his right after his 1st read is covered in his 1st couple of series , then I feel we need to nail the coffin shut and name Tua the rest of the season.

Hear! Hear! Or...Read! Read!

 

[Tidestalker]

Aside from @BamaBoyJosh, I think I may have been the biggest Jalen supporter up until now. I'm still of the wait-and-see how he does with a dedicated QB coach that actually PLAYED QB mindset. But I gotta say-the disparity among receiver distribution, historically, lends to Jalen's 1st read then run mentality argument.

If ENOS hasn't been able to fix that, then Jalen may be a lost cause in that regard. We'll know within the 1st couple of drives when both play. If Jalen repeatedly continues to drift to his right after his 1st read is covered in his 1st couple of series , then I feel we need to nail the coffin shut and name Tua the rest of the season.

Thatta boy!

But I still stand by the idea that both play... And while I'm one of these guys that really believes Tua is elite, Heisman type material... I do believe Jalen can and will help us win games. When you see the support he has from his teammates I think he can bring a boost and different look into the game. I'd prefer it to be maybe 2-3 series a game, which I'm sure wouldn't be good enough for him or daddy, but it would be cool and productive IMO. And the biggest reason believe it or not is because there will be 1-2 wide open deep balls for him in those situations.... DC's will load up, especially if we have a 8+ pt lead (which rarely happened early in big games and Tua can change that) where desperation may be setting in. And on the other end I see Tua giving the running game a huge boost for the opposite reasons. RTR

 

[JoshB]

I know I get the "Jalen fan boy" label on here but I notice something that isn't getting a lot of attention. All the reports from this past scrimmage was that Jalen looked excellent, yet the usual suspects who claim to have "insider info" have not said a peep about the scrimmage (or maybe I just missed it). Just think that's interesting... He apparently threw three picks in the first scrimmage but none in the second along with three touchdowns (and one bomb that the receiver was pushed out at the one on)... I guess Jalen throwing picks is the only thing worthy of discussion...

 

[TerryP]

I know I get the "Jalen fan boy" label on here but I notice something that isn't getting a lot of attention. All the reports from this past scrimmage was that Jalen looked excellent, yet the usual suspects who claim to have "insider info" have not said a peep about the scrimmage (or maybe I just missed it).

It's that way across the 'net with the exception of a few how have doubled down on their Jalen stances. I've seen reference to two videos that have been published with the main point of "this is how bad Jalen is at QB." It's to the point of embarrassment.

And one more thing...

No, I don't consider "don't write Jalen off" as being a "Jalen fan boy."

 

[TUSKtimes]

I know I get the "Jalen fan boy" label on here but I notice something that isn't getting a lot of attention.

In fairness, no one works harder at it.

All the reports from this past scrimmage was that Jalen looked excellent, yet the usual suspects who claim to have "insider info" have not said a peep about the scrimmage (or maybe I just missed it).

This thing works a lot better if you would be more specific about exactly who has all this "inside info." Jalen had a good day. He has those. I thought his Miss State game last season was his best effort of the season. Followed by his worst only 2 weeks later. That's the rub. Consistency is a part of being a great player. We are mainly talking about a player in Tua who may be better than anyone we've seen in this latest era of Bama excellence. A vote for Tua is not a condemnation of Jalen. Never has. For the rest of the controversy, this offseason, see the comments by Jalen, and his Dad.

 

[JoshB]

I know I get the "Jalen fan boy" label on here but I notice something that isn't getting a lot of attention. All the reports from this past scrimmage was that Jalen looked excellent, yet the usual suspects who claim to have "insider info" have not said a peep about the scrimmage (or maybe I just missed it).

It's that way across the 'net with the exception of a few how have doubled down on their Jalen stances. I've seen reference to two videos that have been published with the main point of "this is how bad Jalen is at QB." It's to the point of embarrassment.

And one more thing...

No, I don't consider "don't write Jalen off" as being a "Jalen fan boy."

You're one of the few lol I'm also considered a "Tua hater" because I'm not quite ready to crown him with the Heisman yet.

 

[JoshB]

I know I get the "Jalen fan boy" label on here but I notice something that isn't getting a lot of attention.

In fairness, no one works harder at it.

All the reports from this past scrimmage was that Jalen looked excellent, yet the usual suspects who claim to have "insider info" have not said a peep about the scrimmage (or maybe I just missed it).

This thing works a lot better if you would be more specific about exactly who has all this "inside info." Jalen had a good day. He has those. I thought his Miss State game last season was his best effort of the season. Followed by his worst only 2 weeks later. That's the rub. Consistency is a part of being a great player. We are mainly talking about a player in Tua who may be better than anyone we've seen in this latest era of Bama excellence. A vote for Tua is not a condemnation of Jalen. Never has. For the rest of the controversy, this offseason, see the comments by Jalen, and his Dad.

All of the people that post on boards and social media claiming to have insider info. Don't play dumb. You see the same posts I do and those posts were a plenty when Jalen had a bad scrimmage but were ghost as hell when Tua didn't supposedly perform very well and Jalen supposedly had an excellent one. I am trying to be fair in all of this while others have no intention, that is my point. It's gotten to the point where I honestly believe a certain (very vocal) section of the fan base would boo Jalen if he walked onto the field right now.

 

[ColAngus]

I know I get the "Jalen fan boy" label on here but I notice something that isn't getting a lot of attention.

In fairness, no one works harder at it.

All the reports from this past scrimmage was that Jalen looked excellent, yet the usual suspects who claim to have "insider info" have not said a peep about the scrimmage (or maybe I just missed it).

This thing works a lot better if you would be more specific about exactly who has all this "inside info." Jalen had a good day. He has those. I thought his Miss State game last season was his best effort of the season. Followed by his worst only 2 weeks later. That's the rub. Consistency is a part of being a great player. We are mainly talking about a player in Tua who may be better than anyone we've seen in this latest era of Bama excellence. A vote for Tua is not a condemnation of Jalen. Never has. For the rest of the controversy, this offseason, see the comments by Jalen, and his Dad.

All of the people that post on boards and social media claiming to have insider info. Don't play dumb. You see the same posts I do and those posts were a plenty when Jalen had a bad scrimmage but were ghost as hell when Tua didn't supposedly perform very well and Jalen supposedly had an excellent one. I am trying to be fair in all of this while others have no intention, that is my point. It's gotten to the point where I honestly believe a certain (very vocal) section of the fan base would boo Jalen if he walked onto the field right now.

I wouldn't boo him, but if I have to watch him do his tuck-and-run thing this year I may puke a little.

There's a reason Tua is the favorite to win the Heisman this year. These guys know.

 

['65 Cobra]

Jalen is capable of QB'ing our offense well enough for us to beat most of the teams on our schedule. That is with the collective offense. The problem is that his weaknesses (which have been covered ad nauseum) are so fundamental that they become painfully transparent against better teams and these weaknesses are not showing signs of significant improvement. He becomes a genuine liability against upper tier teams and is actually a detriment to the collective offense in those cases. And therein lies the problem.

 

[JoshB]

and these weaknesses are not showing signs of significant improvement.

This is my problem with the whole argument. This is being said with no factual evidence. We dont know. We havent seen him since the spring. Since he had, in the words of Tua himself, "a real QB coach for the first time." To say "he is showing no signs of significant (or any) improvement" is saying you believe that without actually seeing anything at all.

 

['65 Cobra]

and these weaknesses are not showing signs of significant improvement.

This is my problem with the whole argument. This is being said with no factual evidence. We dont know. We havent seen him since the spring. Since he had, in the words of Tua himself, "a real QB coach for the first time." To say "he is showing no signs of significant (or any) improvement" is saying you believe that without actually seeing anything at all.

I respect your strong feelings on this topic, BBJ, and I don't know that we are necessarily that far off on our viewpoints. I will say, however, as you don't really know what I, or my sources, have actually seen, I will share that a close friend has been present throughout the summer and has seen plenty. Of course, that opinion is shared by many others who have seen much. That notwithstanding, I'm talking about the last two years of play as well as through this summer - that's why I said "...showing no signs of significant improvement..." As an aside, you added the words "(or any)" to my quote, which really misrepresents what I said. Of course, he's made some improvements, but significant is where it falls off, and his competition has caught up.

As I said in my original post, Jalen is quite capable of QB'ing our O to wins against most of our competition. Jalen has skill and talent. I just think Tua has a better set of skills and talents and that he give us a better chance to win against all of our competition, and his presence doesn't require our OC to limit our options.

 

[JoshB]

and these weaknesses are not showing signs of significant improvement.

This is my problem with the whole argument. This is being said with no factual evidence. We dont know. We havent seen him since the spring. Since he had, in the words of Tua himself, "a real QB coach for the first time." To say "he is showing no signs of significant (or any) improvement" is saying you believe that without actually seeing anything at all.

I respect your strong feelings on this topic, BBJ, and I don't know that we are necessarily that far off on our viewpoints. I will say, however, as you don't really know what I, or my sources, have actually seen, I will share that a close friend has been present throughout the summer and has seen plenty. Of course, that opinion is shared by many others who have seen much. That notwithstanding, I'm talking about the last two years of play as well as through this summer - that's why I said "...showing no signs of significant improvement..." As an aside, you added the words "(or any)" to my quote, which really misrepresents what I said. Of course, he's made some improvements, but significant is where it falls off, and his competition has caught up.

As I said in my original post, Jalen is quite capable of QB'ing our O to wins against most of our competition. Jalen has skill and talent. I just think Tua has a better set of skills and talents and that he give us a better chance to win against all of our competition, and his presence doesn't require our OC to limit our options.

I wasn't trying to infer you were saying "any," that's my bad. That was more directed at others who have actually made that comment. I dont have any insider sources, other than the same things I read on the internet that others have. The only practices I've seen over the last two years are the limited time Alabama lets the media roam through for a few minutes. So, I literally have zero inside information. My point was, even if you know someone that does truly have insider info, that doesn't mean it's always accurate, either. All of the reports that Jalen lit up the scrimmage last weekend, while Tua was a lot more pedestrian than he's been labeled in the past could be BS. Just like the previous weeks.

With that said, I understand Tua's skill set and his potential and I've never disagreed with that. I just think Jalen has too much to offer to be written off like so many want to do. Hell, I was damn near ready to write him off after the fan day fiasco, myself.

 

['65 Cobra]

and these weaknesses are not showing signs of significant improvement.

This is my problem with the whole argument. This is being said with no factual evidence. We dont know. We havent seen him since the spring. Since he had, in the words of Tua himself, "a real QB coach for the first time." To say "he is showing no signs of significant (or any) improvement" is saying you believe that without actually seeing anything at all.

I respect your strong feelings on this topic, BBJ, and I don't know that we are necessarily that far off on our viewpoints. I will say, however, as you don't really know what I, or my sources, have actually seen, I will share that a close friend has been present throughout the summer and has seen plenty. Of course, that opinion is shared by many others who have seen much. That notwithstanding, I'm talking about the last two years of play as well as through this summer - that's why I said "...showing no signs of significant improvement..." As an aside, you added the words "(or any)" to my quote, which really misrepresents what I said. Of course, he's made some improvements, but significant is where it falls off, and his competition has caught up.

As I said in my original post, Jalen is quite capable of QB'ing our O to wins against most of our competition. Jalen has skill and talent. I just think Tua has a better set of skills and talents and that he give us a better chance to win against all of our competition, and his presence doesn't require our OC to limit our options.

I wasn't trying to infer you were saying "any," that's my bad. That was more directed at others who have actually made that comment. I dont have any insider sources, other than the same things I read on the internet that others have. The only practices I've seen over the last two years are the limited time Alabama lets the media roam through for a few minutes. So, I literally have zero inside information. My point was, even if you know someone that does truly have insider info, that doesn't mean it's always accurate, either. All of the reports that Jalen lit up the scrimmage last weekend, while Tua was a lot more pedestrian than he's been labeled in the past could be BS. Just like the previous weeks.

With that said, I understand Tua's skill set and his potential and I've never disagreed with that. I just think Jalen has too much to offer to be written off like so many want to do. Hell, I was damn near ready to write him off after the fan day fiasco, myself.

Well, that's a valid point. Even "insiders" can be quite biased. Despite what we all debate around here, I seriously doubt that CNS has written off anybody. I would not be surprised at all to see both guys playing against Louisville. If I remember correctly, back when Phillip Sims and AJ McCarron were battling it out, they both played against some cupcake and then AJ started against Penn State and they never really saw Sims again. With our schedule this year, I wouldn't be surprised if we see them both play - and even Mac Jones against Arky State - up through the Ole Miss game. Either way, I really hope we don't play them both every game regularly. I just think that's asking for trouble.

 

[94 Grad]

and these weaknesses are not showing signs of significant improvement.

This is my problem with the whole argument. This is being said with no factual evidence. We dont know. We havent seen him since the spring. Since he had, in the words of Tua himself, "a real QB coach for the first time." To say "he is showing no signs of significant (or any) improvement" is saying you believe that without actually seeing anything at all.

I respect your strong feelings on this topic, BBJ, and I don't know that we are necessarily that far off on our viewpoints. I will say, however, as you don't really know what I, or my sources, have actually seen, I will share that a close friend has been present throughout the summer and has seen plenty. Of course, that opinion is shared by many others who have seen much. That notwithstanding, I'm talking about the last two years of play as well as through this summer - that's why I said "...showing no signs of significant improvement..." As an aside, you added the words "(or any)" to my quote, which really misrepresents what I said. Of course, he's made some improvements, but significant is where it falls off, and his competition has caught up.

As I said in my original post, Jalen is quite capable of QB'ing our O to wins against most of our competition. Jalen has skill and talent. I just think Tua has a better set of skills and talents and that he give us a better chance to win against all of our competition, and his presence doesn't require our OC to limit our options.

I wasn't trying to infer you were saying "any," that's my bad. That was more directed at others who have actually made that comment. I dont have any insider sources, other than the same things I read on the internet that others have. The only practices I've seen over the last two years are the limited time Alabama lets the media roam through for a few minutes. So, I literally have zero inside information. My point was, even if you know someone that does truly have insider info, that doesn't mean it's always accurate, either. All of the reports that Jalen lit up the scrimmage last weekend, while Tua was a lot more pedestrian than he's been labeled in the past could be BS. Just like the previous weeks.

With that said, I understand Tua's skill set and his potential and I've never disagreed with that. I just think Jalen has too much to offer to be written off like so many want to do. Hell, I was damn near ready to write him off after the fan day fiasco, myself.

Well, that's a valid point. Even "insiders" can be quite biased. Despite what we all debate around here, I seriously doubt that CNS has written off anybody. I would not be surprised at all to see both guys playing against Louisville. If I remember correctly, back when Phillip Sims and AJ McCarron were battling it out, they both played against some cupcake and then AJ started against Penn State and they never really saw Sims again. With our schedule this year, I wouldn't be surprised if we see them both play - and even Mac Jones against Arky State - up through the Ole Miss game. Either way, I really hope we don't play them both every game regularly. I just think that's asking for trouble.

I think it's easiest to just say... Coach Saban has both the Data and the Skill set to be to evaluate and pick the best guy for the role. I really don't understand why we get so worked up about it on the boards. Does it really matter what anyone's insider information is or would suggest... it'll be what it will be and we'll know in a little less than 2 weeks. Regardless, I don't see either guy transferring mid season, so they will both be available if/when needed.

 

[JoshB]

and these weaknesses are not showing signs of significant improvement.

This is my problem with the whole argument. This is being said with no factual evidence. We dont know. We havent seen him since the spring. Since he had, in the words of Tua himself, "a real QB coach for the first time." To say "he is showing no signs of significant (or any) improvement" is saying you believe that without actually seeing anything at all.

I respect your strong feelings on this topic, BBJ, and I don't know that we are necessarily that far off on our viewpoints. I will say, however, as you don't really know what I, or my sources, have actually seen, I will share that a close friend has been present throughout the summer and has seen plenty. Of course, that opinion is shared by many others who have seen much. That notwithstanding, I'm talking about the last two years of play as well as through this summer - that's why I said "...showing no signs of significant improvement..." As an aside, you added the words "(or any)" to my quote, which really misrepresents what I said. Of course, he's made some improvements, but significant is where it falls off, and his competition has caught up.

As I said in my original post, Jalen is quite capable of QB'ing our O to wins against most of our competition. Jalen has skill and talent. I just think Tua has a better set of skills and talents and that he give us a better chance to win against all of our competition, and his presence doesn't require our OC to limit our options.

I wasn't trying to infer you were saying "any," that's my bad. That was more directed at others who have actually made that comment. I dont have any insider sources, other than the same things I read on the internet that others have. The only practices I've seen over the last two years are the limited time Alabama lets the media roam through for a few minutes. So, I literally have zero inside information. My point was, even if you know someone that does truly have insider info, that doesn't mean it's always accurate, either. All of the reports that Jalen lit up the scrimmage last weekend, while Tua was a lot more pedestrian than he's been labeled in the past could be BS. Just like the previous weeks.

With that said, I understand Tua's skill set and his potential and I've never disagreed with that. I just think Jalen has too much to offer to be written off like so many want to do. Hell, I was damn near ready to write him off after the fan day fiasco, myself.

Well, that's a valid point. Even "insiders" can be quite biased. Despite what we all debate around here, I seriously doubt that CNS has written off anybody. I would not be surprised at all to see both guys playing against Louisville. If I remember correctly, back when Phillip Sims and AJ McCarron were battling it out, they both played against some cupcake and then AJ started against Penn State and they never really saw Sims again. With our schedule this year, I wouldn't be surprised if we see them both play - and even Mac Jones against Arky State - up through the Ole Miss game. Either way, I really hope we don't play them both every game regularly. I just think that's asking for trouble.

I think it's easiest to just say... Coach Saban has both the Data and the Skill set to be to evaluate and pick the best guy for the role. I really don't understand why we get so worked up about it on the boards. Does it really matter what anyone's insider information is or would suggest... it'll be what it will be and we'll know in a little less than 2 weeks. Regardless, I don't see either guy transferring mid season, so they will both be available if/when needed.

Because it's the middle of August and everyone is angst for the season to start.

 

[UAgrad93]

I know I get the "Jalen fan boy" label on here but I notice something that isn't getting a lot of attention. All the reports from this past scrimmage was that Jalen looked excellent, yet the usual suspects who claim to have "insider info" have not said a peep about the scrimmage (or maybe I just missed it). Just think that's interesting... He apparently threw three picks in the first scrimmage but none in the second along with three touchdowns (and one bomb that the receiver was pushed out at the one on)... I guess Jalen throwing picks is the only thing worthy of discussion...

I was there for the second scrimmage. Jalen looked good at times, but was never excellent! I also mentioned that there were some saying that he threw a Pick 6 when in fact, no Picks were thrown. If you will go back and take a look at my post in the Fall camp thread this past Sunday, you will see my comments. Jalen hit the 1st read open receiver. Several times, his first read was the deep ball and it was completed. At other times, it was like @Sgt. Lincoln Osiris mentioned, 1st read covered, drift to the right and take off or throw it away. Those saying Jalen was excellent are pushing the Jalen agenda. They are the ones also screaming "26-2 as a starter" and "his last drive against Clemson woulda won the Championship in '16 if it weren't for D. Watson and the defense" while overlooking that we had perhaps the greatest D in college history, we benefitted from 15 NOTS on the year, the offense went 2-17 on third downs which kept the defense on the field for 99 snaps!! Others claim Jalen threw INT after INT and wasn't quite perfect last week because of a PICK 6!! I already called BULLSHIT on that one!! Those people are on the Tua train!! I am for the one that allows us to dictate what we want to do offensively when we want to do it. Tua offers that. He will make a defense not load the box.

 

[JoshB]

I know I get the "Jalen fan boy" label on here but I notice something that isn't getting a lot of attention. All the reports from this past scrimmage was that Jalen looked excellent, yet the usual suspects who claim to have "insider info" have not said a peep about the scrimmage (or maybe I just missed it). Just think that's interesting... He apparently threw three picks in the first scrimmage but none in the second along with three touchdowns (and one bomb that the receiver was pushed out at the one on)... I guess Jalen throwing picks is the only thing worthy of discussion...

I was there for the second scrimmage. Jalen looked good at times, but was never excellent! I also mentioned that there were some saying that he threw a Pick 6 when in fact, no Picks were thrown. If you will go back and take a look at my post in the Fall camp thread this past Sunday, you will see my comments. Jalen hit the 1st read open receiver. Several times, his first read was the deep ball and it was completed. At other times, it was like @Sgt. Lincoln Osiris mentioned, 1st read covered, drift to the right and take off or throw it away. Those saying Jalen was excellent are pushing the Jalen agenda. They are the ones also screaming "26-2 as a starter" and "his last drive against Clemson woulda won the Championship in '16 if it weren't for D. Watson and the defense" while overlooking that we had perhaps the greatest D in college history, we benefitted from 15 NOTS on the year, the offense went 2-17 on third downs which kept the defense on the field for 99 snaps!! Others claim Jalen threw INT after INT and wasn't quite perfect last week because of a PICK 6!! I already called BULLSHIT on that one!! Those people are on the Tua train!! I am for the one that allows us to dictate what we want to do offensively when we want to do it. Tua offers that. He will make a defense not load the box.

See, this is exactly what I'm talking about. You took from it the exact opposite from what I read (and I didn't read it from anyone that had an agenda, they were repeating the stuff about Jalen being bad in the previous scrimmage, too). Example:

-- After a not so great performance in Alabama's first preseason scrimmage, Jalen Hurts bounced back and did very well on Saturday. Hurts threw at least two touchdowns -- one to freshman Jaylen Waddle and one to Henry Ruggs -- and nearly had another on a long pass to Waddle that ended with Waddle getting knocked out of bounds just short of the end zone. Also, after throwing three interceptions during that first scrimmage, Hurts didn't have any on Saturday. While both of the top two quarterbacks had good overall days, it seems like Hurts may have had the better overall performance. Tua Tagovailoa started slow, took a safety at one point, had some near-interceptions and took a couple bad sacks. He did, however, end up throwing at least three touchdowns with no interceptions. The touchdowns were long balls to Waddle and Xavian Marks and a nicely-thrown pass that he squeezed in to a tight space to Derek Kief, who made a diving catch in the end zone.

QB battle heating up, other Alabama scrimmage intel

 

[UAgrad93]

@BamaBoyJosh I looked at the scrimmage through my old coaching eyes and not as someone with an agenda. Just reading what you posted, it seems the person used the “Jalen is better” angle. I don’t recall some near interceptions outside of a ball that shot out of his hand like a watermelon seed. Jalen also delivered a bullet on a 8-10 yard sit down and it shot straight up but no one was able to corral it in. As for a “sack”, one hand touch on a QB for a sack was bullshit!