🏈 Jalen or Tua? Bobby Bowden says 'Nick can't go wrong'

[Krimson]

BBJ, if you truly believe all of what you post you are without a doubt inept at understanding anything related to the QB position. I know you post a lot of crap on here just for the sake of arguing with whoever will argue with you but it is asinine to even put Jalen in the conversation with Tua in regards to QB talent. The team has won in spite of him playing a position he is not qualified for not because of him. They have not had QB for the last 2 years and it nearly cost them a second NC. The defense and running game wins against lesser teams but when they play a team with a defense that is capable of stopping the run and forcing Jalen to pass that also has an offense that can score on Bama Jalen can't win the game with his arm and Tua has shown that he can. You don't need to be an NFL scout, a paid "expert", or even a very knowledgeable fan to know that Tua is the better option if you want the O to actually throw the ball. So keep spouting your BS but anyone who knows even a little about football knows that you're full of it. And yes, Mac Jones is a better QB.

 

[JoshB]

BBJ, if you truly believe all of what you post you are without a doubt inept at understanding anything related to the QB position. I know you post a lot of crap on here just for the sake of arguing with whoever will argue with you but it is asinine to even put Jalen in the conversation with Tua in regards to QB talent. The team has won in spite of him playing a position he is not qualified for not because of him. They have not had QB for the last 2 years and it nearly cost them a second NC. The defense and running game wins against lesser teams but when they play a team with a defense that is capable of stopping the run and forcing Jalen to pass that also has an offense that can score on Bama Jalen can't win the game with his arm and Tua has shown that he can. You don't need to be an NFL scout, a paid "expert", or even a very knowledgeable fan to know that Tua is the better option if you want the O to actually throw the ball. So keep spouting your BS but anyone who knows even a little about football knows that you're full of it. And yes, Mac Jones is a better QB.

When someone spouts out nonsense like you just regurgitated its hopeless.

By the way, I have no idea who you even are.

 

[TUSKtimes]

Is this seriously what you're hanging your hat on? Please go back and watch every single A-Day game the last 10 years and tell me how the performance of ANY QB in that game had a barring on what you saw in the ensuing fall...

That's not fair. If we are going to be honest about who is the better QB than every practice matters. When that practice looked as tentative as some of his worst games just a few months before I think saying it the way we all saw it is just being fair. Isn't this going to be the same measuring stick in fall camp?

But to answer your question, Mac had a better game. He also played against the backup defense, while Jalen played against the starters. If you HONESTLY think Mac Jones is the better QB (which you have already said) there is absolutely nothing else ANYONE needs to discuss with you. I don't feel like killing more braincells.

And that's fair. Jalen wasn't throwing the ball with much conviction in the spring game. I also thought Jalen did a much better job in the spring game the year before with his confidence. Something is amiss with his mechanics and I've said that for the longest. Why shouldn't that matter last season, this spring and this fall?

 

[JoshB]

Is this seriously what you're hanging your hat on? Please go back and watch every single A-Day game the last 10 years and tell me how the performance of ANY QB in that game had a barring on what you saw in the ensuing fall...

That's not fair. If we are going to be honest about who is the better QB than every practice matters. When that practice looked as tentative as some of his worst games just a few months before I think saying it the way we all saw it is just being fair. Isn't this going to be the same measuring stick in fall camp?

But to answer your question, Mac had a better game. He also played against the backup defense, while Jalen played against the starters. If you HONESTLY think Mac Jones is the better QB (which you have already said) there is absolutely nothing else ANYONE needs to discuss with you. I don't feel like killing more braincells.

And that's fair. Jalen wasn't throwing the ball with much conviction in the spring game. I also thought Jalen did a much better job in the spring game the year before with his confidence. Something is amiss with his mechanics and I've said that for the longest. Why shouldn't that matter last season, this spring and this fall?

Spring games are like watching pre season games, man. It doesn't tell you much of anything. I remember AJ McCarron threw like four picks one year at A-Day, then went on to break the single season passing record and win a national championship.

Every practice matters but we see very little of actual practice time and from what the coaches have said, plus Jalen's performances at camps in the off season, he has looked better. These guys are suggesting that not only is Jalen not a good QB but that Mac Jones is better. It's just ridiculous.

 

[Tidestalker]

You guys cant just let this shit play out,

Jalen will be starting on Sept. 1, though.

I love it. LMAO

I also said both will play. Jalen starting isn't indicative of him "winning" the competition. I think he'll get the start because of his experience but both will play. Either we won't have a true "winner" until SEC play starts or both will play together all year. Letting it play out is not shitting on the coaching staff or players through this process. I love how you can call me out for saying that Jalen will start the opener but dude says Saban is "out of touch" if Tua isn't the all out starter right off the bat lmao

Because he's right... If Saban starts Jalen after what you've seen from both dudes under the big lights, and what you've seen from Jalen against the great comp, then I'd have to agree.

But CNS way too good of a coach to let that happen. So it's a moot point anyway.

Just found it funny you complain about how everyone shouldn't prognosticate or talk shit on an Alabama football message board about Alabama football, then you end your soliloquy by talking shit and prognosticating. Surely even you see the humor in that. Especially knowing how you were bitching and moaning leading up to and during the title game about the possibility of Tua playing... And how that ended.

Ultimately, pretty much aside from Terry we are all just talking shit. No one thinks they know more than Nick Saban but at the same time the guy makes mistakes. Nothing wrong with talking about those mistakes or pointing out what could have been or will be depending on those decisions.

 

[JoshB]

You guys cant just let this shit play out,

Jalen will be starting on Sept. 1, though.

I love it. LMAO

I also said both will play. Jalen starting isn't indicative of him "winning" the competition. I think he'll get the start because of his experience but both will play. Either we won't have a true "winner" until SEC play starts or both will play together all year. Letting it play out is not shitting on the coaching staff or players through this process. I love how you can call me out for saying that Jalen will start the opener but dude says Saban is "out of touch" if Tua isn't the all out starter right off the bat lmao

Because he's right... If Saban starts Jalen after what you've seen from both dudes under the big lights, and what you've seen from Jalen against the great comp, then I'd have to agree.

But CNS way too good of a coach to let that happen. So it's a moot point anyway.

Just found it funny you complain about how everyone shouldn't prognosticate or talk shit on an Alabama football message board about Alabama football, then you end your soliloquy by talking shit and prognosticating. Surely even you see the humor in that. Especially knowing how you were bitching and moaning leading up to and during the title game about the possibility of Tua playing... And how that ended.

Ultimately, pretty much aside from Terry we are all just talking shit. No one thinks they know more than Nick Saban but at the same time the guy makes mistakes. Nothing wrong with talking about those mistakes or pointing out what could have been or will be depending on those decisions.

Where did I say no one should talk shit? Also, where did I say Nick Saban doesn't make mistakes? I said maybe let it play out (which by the way, is going to go past the first game) before making ridiculous, asinine claims like "Saban is out of touch if he starts Jalen".

 

[Sgt. Lincoln Osiris]

The one GLARING fact that all you Tua gurus are failing to see, to spite the nose on your face, is a fact that is set with historical precedent.

Spinning a ball means DICK if you haven't grasped every aspect of the given requirements of your position at BAMA. I don't give a flying rat's ass if you were an Elite 11 winner.

Ask Derrick Henry why HE didn't play more his freshman year. Despite ALLLLLLLLLLLLL the talent he had as a pure runner, that still didn't make him a great full-package running back at the elite college level his freshman year, worthy of assuming the starting role even up thru the bowl game. He hadn't learned how to effectively pass pro. He hadn't learned the intricacies of the offense from the RB position.

Tua may be, and maybe had been a better pure passer than Jalen during the regular season. But Saban wasn't comfortable with playing him more FOR A REASON. The same reason he wasn't comfortable playing DH more his frosh year. He hadn't grown into the position as a full-package player yet.

To say Saban made a mistake just because you think Tua could "spin the ball better" is quite a bit short sighted. And I have to agree with @BamaBoyJosh here with respect to everyone's "expertise" on the quarterback POSITION just by seeing someone "spin the ball".

 

[TerryP]

BBJ, if you truly believe all of what you post you are without a doubt inept at understanding anything related to the QB position. I know you post a lot of crap on here just for the sake of arguing with whoever will argue with you but it is asinine to even put Jalen in the conversation with Tua in regards to QB talent

Passing talent. Passing. It's one part of a QB's skill set. Does Jalen have issues there? Yes. Is that all that's required of a quarterback? No.

I have no problems with people talking about Tua's future and how dynamic he may turn out to be. He shows promise of being an exceptional player. I have no problems with people watching Jalen and surmising the pressure gets to him, mentally, too quickly. We've seen that from day one (and seen it improve.)

I have problems with people saying Jalen isn't a quarterback as if passing the ball is the one and only thing that defines what a quarterback brings to the field. It's simply not true.

 

[BrianG1979]

Jalen wins until it comes to the games that count.... I am not going to pretend to know more than Saban but I saw how the team came alive when Tua was in the game.

 

[Tidestalker]

The one GLARING fact that all you Tua gurus are failing to see, to spite the nose on your face, is a fact that is set with historical precedent.

Spinning a ball means DICK if you haven't grasped every aspect of the given requirements of your position at BAMA. I don't give a flying rat's ass if you were an Elite 11 winner.

Ask Derrick Henry why HE didn't play more his freshman year. Despite ALLLLLLLLLLLLL the talent he had as a pure runner, that still didn't make him a great full-package running back at the elite college level his freshman year, worthy of assuming the starting role even up thru the bowl game. He hadn't learned how to effectively pass pro. He hadn't learned the intricacies of the offense from the RB position.

Tua may be, and maybe had been a better pure passer than Jalen during the regular season. But Saban wasn't comfortable with playing him more FOR A REASON. The same reason he wasn't comfortable playing DH more his frosh year. He hadn't grown into the position as a full-package player yet.

To say Saban made a mistake just because you think Tua could "spin the ball better" is quite a bit short sighted. And I have to agree with @BamaBoyJosh here with respect to everyone's "expertise" on the quarterback POSITION just by seeing someone "spin the ball".

It's a lot more than spinning the ball, homeslice.

He's either got more confidence, bigger balls, or can read a defense a hell of a lot better than Jalen... Cause we all watched the same game against the same team and saw 2 different QB's. And you're right, Tua does spin it a hell of a lot better as well.

1 question..... With his back against the wall, chips on the table, title on the line.... Who did Saban go to?

That is why he's the #1. There is a short list of reasons Jalen will be #2... But we all know those.

 

[planomateo]

That new 4 game rule will help with these types of competitions.

 

[alagator]

Jalen wins until it comes to the games that count.... I am not going to pretend to know more than Saban but I saw how the team came alive when Tua was in the game.

This statement gives a lot of ammunition to those who point to his win vs loss record. There are those who point to the two games where he started and the Tide lost without pointing to so many games he won: games that mattered. Clemson in the playoff's last year mattered. SEC games the last two seasons mattered.

I have a hard time wrapping my mind around something alluded to here, "the team came alive when Tua was in the game." This is stated despite the fact Georgia players said they weren't prepared for Tua.

While hindsight can be 20/20 fans can't use it to look back and criticize past decisions. I see many yelling about Auburn. I see few mention half the team was fighting the flu that week or give credit where it's due: Auburn could have beaten any team in the nation at home that weekend or the few weeks preceding these games.

 

[mrchase]

As a fan.....all I'm going to say is..... BE CAREFUL WHAT YOU WISH FOR.

 

[Tidestalker]

Jalen wins until it comes to the games that count.... I am not going to pretend to know more than Saban but I saw how the team came alive when Tua was in the game.

This statement gives a lot of ammunition to those who point to his win vs loss record. There are those who point to the two games where he started and the Tide lost without pointing to so many games he won: games that mattered. Clemson in the playoff's last year mattered. SEC games the last two seasons mattered.

I have a hard time wrapping my mind around something alluded to here, "the team came alive when Tua was in the game." This is stated despite the fact Georgia players said they weren't prepared for Tua.

While hindsight can be 20/20 fans can't use it to look back and criticize past decisions. I see many yelling about Auburn. I see few mention half the team was fighting the flu that week or give credit where it's due: Auburn could have beaten any team in the nation at home that weekend or the few weeks preceding these games.

Context regarding the Clemson game... Jalen was 16-24 for 120 yards and 2 TD's. 1 of those TD's was to D. Payne, and the D absolutely dominated Clemson that night, including the fact they outscored Clemson by themselves. So no, I'm not that impressed with what Jalen did that night.

In regards to Auburn... The offense sucked. Jalen was 12-22 for 122 yards. 2/3 biggest games he threw for a total of 240 yards, and I'm not even counting the first half of the Georgia game where many seem to forget how over that game felt until Tua came in.

There are a lot of reasons to point out why Jalen is a very good option... But using his history in big games isn't one of them. Because we've literally tried to win games around his inability to throw down the field. That's hard to do against good defenses.

 

[TerryP]

In regards to Auburn... The offense sucked. Jalen was 12-22 for 122 yards. 2/3 biggest games he threw for a total of 240 yards, and I'm not even counting the first half of the Georgia game where many seem to forget how over that game felt until Tua came in.

There are a lot of reasons to point out why Jalen is a very good option... But using his history in big games isn't one of them. Because we've literally tried to win games around his inability to throw down the field. That's hard to do against good defenses.

Using Auburn, at home, isn't a good measure either. You've nailed it in one sentence here, "That's hard to do against good defenses." Ask Fromm and he'll tell you the same thing about playing Auburn, at home, late in the year last season.

I'd bet we'd find 90%+ of a group of people say Fromm is a better downfield passer than Jalen. It didn't help that weekend; his numbers are almost identical to Jalen's.

 

[Tidestalker]

In regards to Auburn... The offense sucked. Jalen was 12-22 for 122 yards. 2/3 biggest games he threw for a total of 240 yards, and I'm not even counting the first half of the Georgia game where many seem to forget how over that game felt until Tua came in.

There are a lot of reasons to point out why Jalen is a very good option... But using his history in big games isn't one of them. Because we've literally tried to win games around his inability to throw down the field. That's hard to do against good defenses.

Using Auburn, at home, isn't a good measure either. You've nailed it in one sentence here, "That's hard to do against good defenses." Ask Fromm and he'll tell you the same thing about playing Auburn, at home, late in the year last season.

I'd bet we'd find 90%+ of a group of people say Fromm is a better downfield passer than Jalen. It didn't help that weekend; his numbers are almost identical to Jalen's.

AND IT WASN'T GOOD ENOUGH. Right?

Love the other point we see on this forum about how the Georgia defense wasn't "prepared" for Tua. Think about what that means. Basically saying the Georgia defense wasn't prepared for a QB to actually beat them throwing the ball down field. LOL. So they expected to push up on the LOS all night and watch Jalen struggle mightly trying to "carve them up" with a short passing game to Ridley and RB's.

What I think most people miss is how much Tua at QB is going to open up the traditional running game.... That second half of the UGA game, how the ball got spread around and lots of guys PRODUCED (including RB's), is something Jalen just can't replicate against good defenses. He can produce in other ways, most notably his legs, but others around him just aren't as threatening.

 

[Tidestalker]

Jalen Hurts Playoff Stats:

Washington:
7/14 - 57 Yards - 0 TD - 0 INT (19/50 Rush Yards)

Clemson #1:
13/31 - 130 Yards - 1 TD - 0 INT (10/63 Rush Yards)

Clemson #2:
16/24 - 120 Yards - 2 TD - 0 INT (11/40 Rush Yards)

Georgia:
3/8 - 21 Yards - 0 TD - 0 INT (6/40 Rush Yards)

Combined:
39/67 - 328 Yards - 3 TD - 0 INT (46/193 Rush Yards)

Average in 4 Playoff Appearances:
9.75/16.75 - 82 Yards - .75 TD - 0 INT (Avg: 11.5/48))
Total Yards Accounted For: 130 YPG

 

[TerryP]

Love the other point we see on this forum about how the Georgia defense wasn't "prepared" for Tua. Think about what that means. Basically saying the Georgia defense wasn't prepared for a QB to actually beat them throwing the ball down field. LOL

I know exactly what that means. Kirby and his defensive staff didn't prepare for Tua. His own players said so after the game while their coach was lying through his teeth.

And people wonder why I still have huge question marks about Kirby. Hell, I'm seeing the signs already that he's already falling into the Mack Brown / Tommy Tuberville role in recruiting--going into his third year--thinking he can recruit from behind his desk.

What I think most people miss is how much Tua at QB is going to open up the traditional running game.... That second half of the UGA game, how the ball got spread around and lots of guys PRODUCED (including RB's), is something Jalen just can't replicate against good defenses. He can produce in other ways, most notably his legs, but others around him just aren't as threatening.

No one misses this. No one doesn't see the potential Tua has and what it would mean.

While I can't speak for everyone let me repeat myself just to be clear.

You can not judge a quarterback based on one aspect of his game. People are saying Jalen isn't a quarterback because he has problems with downfield passing--an area that can be improved upon. People say "he'll never make it in the pro's as a quarterback." I say "who the hell cares right now?"

 

[Tidestalker]

Love the other point we see on this forum about how the Georgia defense wasn't "prepared" for Tua. Think about what that means. Basically saying the Georgia defense wasn't prepared for a QB to actually beat them throwing the ball down field. LOL

I know exactly what that means. Kirby and his defensive staff didn't prepare for Tua. His own players said so after the game while their coach was lying through his teeth.

And people wonder why I still have huge question marks about Kirby. Hell, I'm seeing the signs already that he's already falling into the Mack Brown / Tommy Tuberville role in recruiting--going into his third year--thinking he can recruit from behind his desk.

What I think most people miss is how much Tua at QB is going to open up the traditional running game.... That second half of the UGA game, how the ball got spread around and lots of guys PRODUCED (including RB's), is something Jalen just can't replicate against good defenses. He can produce in other ways, most notably his legs, but others around him just aren't as threatening.

No one misses this. No one doesn't see the potential Tua has and what it would mean.

While I can't speak for everyone let me repeat myself just to be clear.

You can not judge a quarterback based on one aspect of his game. People are saying Jalen isn't a quarterback because he has problems with downfield passing--an area that can be improved upon. People say "he'll never make it in the pro's as a quarterback." I say "who the hell cares right now?"

All true... And fair. RTR

 

[Krimson]

BBJ, if you truly believe all of what you post you are without a doubt inept at understanding anything related to the QB position. I know you post a lot of crap on here just for the sake of arguing with whoever will argue with you but it is asinine to even put Jalen in the conversation with Tua in regards to QB talent

Passing talent. Passing. It's one part of a QB's skill set. Does Jalen have issues there? Yes. Is that all that's required of a quarterback? No.

I have no problems with people talking about Tua's future and how dynamic he may turn out to be. He shows promise of being an exceptional player. I have no problems with people watching Jalen and surmising the pressure gets to him, mentally, too quickly. We've seen that from day one (and seen it improve.)

I have problems with people saying Jalen isn't a quarterback as if passing the ball is the one and only thing that defines what a quarterback brings to the field. It's simply not true.

I agree that there are many more aspects to being a QB than just passing the ball, like reading the d, checking down, understanding timing, etc. Can Jalen do any of those well? If there has ever been a successful pro style offense with a QB who can't do those things I'm unaware of it. Jalen put up decent numbers his first year because of Lane's play calling, like a lot of his passing numbers coming from glorified hand offs. I have no doubt he could be successful at gt or Navy but not in a pro style offense.