🏈 Hurts, Bateman, Barnett and the QB competition

 
I'm not sure all the Bama graybeards and diehard loyalist are always adapting to the change of offensive philosophy that has been evolving. It's becoming clearer that when Saban and Kiffin decided to become the odd couple for the greater good they were scheming something up in the kitchen that has no written recipe. From standing on the sidelines to using cue cards to the hurry up and no huddle to all the new spread concepts, this thing is getting innovative and pretty exciting. Frankly, this isn't the AJ McCarron approach anymore. The concepts we are establishing are crying for a playmaker that can pull the trigger. More than anything, our new recipe calls for our QB to be a lot more mobile with just a touch of swashbuckler thrown in for good measure. Keeping errors down to a manageable level is obviously important, but in a dynamic offense that is executing at a high level it's shouldn't get the scrutiny of past Bama offenses which took a more conservative approach. If Hurts has that DNA and enough maturity to fit the job description I think the master chefs in this kitchen will do something we haven't seen before.

The resurrection of Lane Kiffin
 
So according to every single person with two eyes and a brain, Jalen Hurts is the best QB on the roster, and has had the best performance by far in every viewing period, including a live scrimmage.
Why is it so hard then to assume that he's leading for the job? Have our coaches proven themselves to be THAT dense in selecting a quarterback?
If he continues these incredible performances, do you think the coaches will give him the job soon so we can actually start building the offense around him, or will indecision cost us a game like last year?
 
uofarolltide said:
So according to every single person with two eyes and a brain, Jalen Hurts is the best QB on the roster, and has had the best performance by far in every viewing period, including a live scrimmage.
Why is it so hard then to assume that he's leading for the job? Have our coaches proven themselves to be THAT dense in selecting a quarterback?
If he continues these incredible performances, do you think the coaches will give him the job soon so we can actually start building the offense around him, or will indecision cost us a game like last year?
Click to expand...

1. The viewing period is only about 10 minutes and is primarily a warm up period. I don't think that is enough time to select a starting QB.
2. I'm sure that Hurts is the most athletic of the bunch. No one has really seen his decision-making ability. The scrimmage next Saturday will be viewed by many people that can evaluate better (it's open for all football lettermen). They won't know Saban's evaluation criteria, but they'll see more than the average fan or media member.
3. He is a freshman. There is a significant difference between high school and major college decision making. If you look at the history of Alabama football (not just the Saban era), when was the last time a true freshman started at QB?
4. If he continues to impress, he will get playing time. As a freshman, he'll need to be significantly better than the others to earn the start.
 
16Champs said:
Based on neither being able to pass Bateman on the depth chart?
Click to expand...

There is no depth chart. This was the first acrimony and any perceived advantage Bateman has in knowledge, experience, and nit making mistakes is negated by the fact that he's turning the ball over more than anyone else, that he's not making the big plays the other 2 are, and lacks the physical skills the other 2 have.

Bateman has gotten the benefit of the doubt so far due to seniority, but his performance has been below the other 2, clearly.
 
NickelDoubleDog said:
There is no depth chart. This was the first acrimony and any perceived advantage Bateman has in knowledge, experience, and nit making mistakes is negated by the fact that he's turning the ball over more than anyone else, that he's not making the big plays the other 2 are, and lacks the physical skills the other 2 have.

Bateman has gotten the benefit of the doubt so far due to seniority, but his performance has been below the other 2, clearly.
Click to expand...

You're making assumptions based on "observations" from ppl that we dont even know if actually observed ANYTHING.
 
Birdman37 said:
You're making assumptions based on "observations" from ppl that we dont even know if actually observed ANYTHING.
Click to expand...

No. we're making assessments based on the spring game, what reporters said about the open practice, and what insiders said who viewed the scrimmage, and what every single freaking witness account out there has said, and there are many.
The assumption made was that Bateman was the leader based on seniority and his miserable performance in games last season.
The assumptions being made are that the younger QBs have no chance because they're younger.

If we just look at the facts, and the information available from all witnesses, it's clear that Barnett and Hurts are a cut above, and that Hurts is really amazing with special athletic ability, while Barnett is a bit inconsistent.

There are a lot of insiders out there, and not ONE of them will disagree that Hurts is a special player, and clearly looks like Saban's best QB ever at Alabama.
 
NickelDoubleDog said:
OK buddy. Nobody saw anything. All the practice reports have been made up.
Click to expand...

Those practice reports are created from a 10-15 minute media viewing period, which is nothing more than bland player drills. I've been to those viewing periods, there is nothing you can really gain from them (other than rotation SOMETIMES and injuries) and comments from Saban...

uofarolltide said:
No. we're making assessments based on the spring game, what reporters said about the open practice, and what insiders said who viewed the scrimmage, and what every single freaking witness account out there has said, and there are many.
The assumption made was that Bateman was the leader based on seniority and his miserable performance in games last season.
The assumptions being made are that the younger QBs have no chance because they're younger.

If we just look at the facts, and the information available from all witnesses, it's clear that Barnett and Hurts are a cut above, and that Hurts is really amazing with special athletic ability, while Barnett is a bit inconsistent.

There are a lot of insiders out there, and not ONE of them will disagree that Hurts is a special player, and clearly looks like Saban's best QB ever at Alabama.
Click to expand...

A spring game that means nothing (pretty much every starting QB in the past 6 years has not had a good spring game so throw that right on out), reporters only see 10-15 minute viewing periods, and we have no idea if any of these "insiders" even actually were at the scrimmage. And "every single witness account" has pretty much contradicted each other...

We have very few facts to go on here...

I dont disagree that Hurts MAY end up being special, I hope so, I hope I'm wrong about him starting, but everyone does this every single year. And what actually ends up happens is usually the complete opposite of what "the insiders" say is going to happen... That is my point.
 
uofarolltide said:
Why is it so hard then to assume that he's leading for the job?
Click to expand...

It's easy to assume that, but that doesn't make it right.

We know when the team started yesterday Cooper took the first snaps with the 1's. We know Barnett was second in rotation. We know these two guys took the majority of the snaps with the 1's.

A little deduction and it tells us where they are sitting right now. With no one reason to think after scrimmage one there's been a change, why even assume there's the possibility of one?
 
NickelDoubleDog said:
There is no depth chart. This was the first acrimony and any perceived advantage Bateman has in knowledge, experience, and nit making mistakes is negated by the fact that he's turning the ball over more than anyone else, that he's not making the big plays the other 2 are, and lacks the physical skills the other 2 have.

Bateman has gotten the benefit of the doubt so far due to seniority, but his performance has been below the other 2, clearly.
Click to expand...
Yet, we have the head coach say all are improving?

The notion, or even the mere suggestion, that there isn't a depth chart with the quarterbacks makes little sense to me. If one guy is the first one up in drills, and he's the first one getting snaps with the 1's, he's leading the depth chart. It's been that way since day one of Saban's tenure in Baton Rouge.

The way you're framing his performance this spring takes nothing into context. Throwing the most INT's against whom? Saying he's not making the big plays goes directly against what's been seen in practices. We're less than 24 hours removed from Saban commenting on the decision making of all three guys; not just to two guys chasing Cooper. There are people describing his passes as punts, yet there's video evidence here of him making some 35-40 yard throws that are far, far from looping passes.

Fans are choosing to make their judgments. They are seeing what they want to see. I don't see anything that could persuade me otherwise.

What's sorely mistaken is the notion these fans know what the coaches are seeing. I suspect, with some thought, they'd know what Saban is looking for—someone who has control over the offense.

Oh, and the person most lauded for having control over the offense? Yeah, that's why assumptions should be left alone right now.
 
Actually arm strength, mechanics, and release are perfectly visible during the viewing period.

Ever heard the saying, "beware the critics unless all the critics agree?" Well, all the critics agree that Bateman has the weakest arm in the QB rotation. Angle it all you want, but that lack in arm strength will likely be preyed upon in the SEC at some point in time. (heaven forbid he should have to run a two minute drill directly into a stiff wind to claim a victory)

You know we all made those "Coker throws far" jokes last season, but if he didnt have that arm we would have lost the championship last year. That throw Coker made while falling backward/being tackled to Ardarius Stewart fifty yards downfield before Stewart ever turned around ? Are you kidding me ? That set up all the big plays that were to come. If that drive stalls we lose. Bateman couldn't have made that throw if you gave him 100 chances at it. He simply does not have the arm strength.

Does anyone recall seeing Bateman get caught with that deer in the headlights look when he had 15 yards in front of him if he would simply tuck the ball and run vs O.M. last year ? What do you attribute that to ? I know what I make of it, but there is no need for me to openly speculate about it.

I'm not sure how or why anyone wants BB. He had the worst spring of all the QB's; literally a pick 6 machine. Why is the fanbase giving him a pass for that ? Pick 6's guys ? He threw more pick 6's than TD's ! He was the MVP of the defense. If Cooper B. had thrown that many pick 6's there would be riots in the streets if he won the job, but this fanbase seems willing to forget all that, and welcome him with open arms for some reason. I'm not saying he cant be the guy; I'm simply pointing out that everyone seems quick to forget about all the really bad turnovers he is responsible for. How about him running around during ADay back there trying to use CNS for a block ? What the hell was that ? lol

Now we get this son of a coach prospect at QB who according to all the critics has:

1. the strongest arm, or at least = to the strongest arm
2. by far the better legs... infinitely better. A real game changer.
3. Poise beyond his years (and to my observation during ADay much more poise than any of the others-(ice cold water in the veins)

4. His release looks better to me for whatever that is worth to anyone reading right now. Never been a fan of BB8's release.
5. Zero doubt he is the most athletic.

Did anyone watch his Sr. highlight reel I posted ? The guy has no wasted motion.

Winning a title is such a long shot. Every game counts the same, but you have got to be your best in November and beyond.

Ask yourself... which QB if given the opportunity will be best in late November ? Which one will give Bama its best chance at winning in a playoff if given the snaps this season ?

Now ask yourself this... if Bama should fall short, or if Bama should be eliminated in the playoff which QB would offer the better chance of winning next season if given the opportunity to develop this season ? I know who my money is on.
 
T&B said:
Actually arm strength, mechanics, and release are perfectly visible during the viewing period.

Ever heard the saying, "beware the critics unless all the critics agree?" Well, all the critics agree that Bateman has the weakest arm in the QB rotation. Angle it all you want, but that lack in arm strength will likely be preyed upon in the SEC at some point in time. (heaven forbid he should have to run a two minute drill directly into a stiff wind to claim a victory)

You know we all made those "Coker throws far" jokes last season, but if he didnt have that arm we would have lost the championship last year. That throw Coker made while falling backward/being tackled to Ardarius Stewart fifty yards downfield before Stewart ever turned around ? Are you kidding me ? That set up all the big plays that were to come. If that drive stalls we lose. Bateman couldn't have made that throw if you gave him 100 chances at it. He simply does not have the arm strength.

Does anyone recall seeing Bateman get caught with that deer in the headlights look when he had 15 yards in front of him if he would simply tuck the ball and run vs O.M. last year ? What do you attribute that to ? I know what I make of it, but there is no need for me to openly speculate about it.

I'm not sure how or why anyone wants BB. He had the worst spring of all the QB's; literally a pick 6 machine. Why is the fanbase giving him a pass for that ? Pick 6's guys ? He threw more pick 6's than TD's ! He was the MVP of the defense. If Cooper B. had thrown that many pick 6's there would be riots in the streets if he won the job, but this fanbase seems willing to forget all that, and welcome him with open arms for some reason. I'm not saying he cant be the guy; I'm simply pointing out that everyone seems quick to forget about all the really bad turnovers he is responsible for. How about him running around during ADay back there trying to use CNS for a block ? What the hell was that ? lol

Now we get this son of a coach prospect at QB who according to all the critics has:

1. the strongest arm, or at least = to the strongest arm
2. by far the better legs... infinitely better. A real game changer.
3. Poise beyond his years (and to my observation during ADay much more poise than any of the others-(ice cold water in the veins)

4. His release looks better to me for whatever that is worth to anyone reading right now. Never been a fan of BB8's release.
5. Zero doubt he is the most athletic.

Did anyone watch his Sr. highlight reel I posted ? The guy has no wasted motion.

Winning a title is such a long shot. Every game counts the same, but you have got to be your best in November and beyond.

Ask yourself... which QB if given the opportunity will be best in late November ? Which one will give Bama its best chance at winning in a playoff if given the snaps this season ?

Now ask yourself this... if Bama should fall short, or if Bama should be eliminated in the playoff which QB would offer the better chance of winning next season if given the opportunity to develop this season ? I know who my money is on.
Click to expand...

And? People argued that AJ McCarron had a "stronger arm" than Greg McElroy. Guess who started?

People argued that Coker had a stronger arm than Sims. Guess who started?

Because the media gets to see who has the "stronger arm" in drills doesnt mean shit in regards to who will be the starter. And by the way, Hurts doesnt have a stronger arm than Cornwell. Period. End of subject. So can we stop with that myth?

BB was a pick six machine? I didnt see any pick sixes. How many did you? Oh you didnt. You only heard from "insiders" that he was a "pick six machine." The same "insiders" that said Barnett would start as a true freshman? Or the ones that said Alec Morris was the best QB of the bunch last year? Maybe it was the "insiders" that said Lacy was the best running back on the team as a freshman.

We dont know shit about who is or isn't going to be the starter. These "insider" accounts of scrimmages do nothing but stir up discussion and arguments. There is a reason you see 5 or 6 posts around the internet that will say completely opposite things. Then all of a sudden 5 or 6 that are identical (just repeating what others have said)... Saban is purposely vague about all of this stuff. I'm not saying that it isn't still a competition but I am saying that Saban likely knows who it is or isnt going to be already.

And guess what? I dont give a damn if it is Batemen... or Hurts... or Barnett... or Cornwell... or if they just say "to hell with it" and let Bo go back to playing quarterback. Whoever the QB is, is fine with me, as long as he wins. If he doesnt, next man up.
 
Birdman37 said:
...Maybe it was the "insiders" that said Lacy was the best running back on the team as a freshman...
Click to expand...

I agree with most all your sentiment on the topic. But, the "insiders" at least promote interest and discussion/debate regardless of the authenticity of their claims of closeness to the program or network of "sources."

That said, the Lacy bit from your post was taken from Burns' comments in 2009-2010. Can't find the quote, but he made a comment to the effect that the most talented RB on the team may be Lacy who was a RS. Of course, all the insiders took that and ran with it. They failed to latch on to the other part of the Burns' comment where he made it clear that he was talking about potential, and Lacy wasn't quite there yet mentally or physically for the position, hence the RS. We saw in 2010 that Lacy's potential was very high, and we saw that he still had plenty to improve on in terms of consistency.

I'm not bashing the "insiders." And, I don't particular care where the info is gathered from or even if it is pure fiction. It is the Internet afterall and all of our e-personas are artificial in themselves. I simply chalk their input up to opinion or speculation. As I said, at least it keeps the board active, so it's not all bad.
 
Do we consider Suttles an insider? Because this quote really caught my eye:

I still think Cooper Bateman will take the first snap of the scrimmage with the ones today, but I continue to hold the belief that Jalen Hurts is the best quarterback on the roster.
Click to expand...

Rarely do the Bama beat writers go out on a limb like this, because they know Saban is going to verbally assault them the next time they ask a marginal question. To me, that was a good sign that Hurts appears to be special.

I know people don't want to hear it but I've always felt like playing 2 QB's is a decent option. It's not ideal, but at least until one of them looks good enough to be the guy.

The inriguing thing about Hurts is his wheels. When things break down there's so much value in a guy that can take off. If he indeed scored a 50 yard TD in the scrimmage, that's special whether it's against 1st or 8th team defense... There's enough depth for 3 SEC defenses on this roster.

Terry made a point that the scrimmage stats are always skewed... And he's right. But it's hard to explain why absolutely none were released. Could be to keep the QB competition as close to the vest as possible... And if a certain "more experienced" QB threw 2 INT's, maybe Saban doesn't want to kill his confidence after just 1 scrimmage. Especially if the INT's were bad luck or great plays. Just saying there's a reason he didn't release stats despite doing so in every other scrimmage I can remember. JMO
 
Che Boludo said:
I agree with most all your sentiment on the topic. But, the "insiders" at least promote interest and discussion/debate regardless of the authenticity of their claims of closeness to the program or network of "sources."

That said, the Lacy bit from your post was taken from Burns' comments in 2009-2010. Can't find the quote, but he made a comment to the effect that the most talented RB on the team may be Lacy who was a RS. Of course, all the insiders took that and ran with it. They failed to latch on to the other part of the Burns' comment where he made it clear that he was talking about potential, and Lacy wasn't quite there yet mentally or physically for the position, hence the RS. We saw in 2010 that Lacy's potential was very high, and we saw that he still had plenty to improve on in terms of consistency.

I'm not bashing the "insiders." And, I don't particular care where the info is gathered from or even if it is pure fiction. It is the Internet afterall and all of our e-personas are artificial in themselves. I simply chalk their input up to opinion or speculation. As I said, at least it keeps the board active, so it's not all bad.
Click to expand...

Have no problem with generating interest and discussion, and we are fans so we are always going to take any little bit of info and run with it. Thats the problem with people that claim to be insiders who are lying and just doing it to stir ppl up and/or make people think they are more important than they are. There are very few ppl out there that are truly insiders that will talk on the internet. Most of those that actually have inside info keep it to themselves though there is the few out there that we will get little nuggets from here and there (there are a few on here).
 
Bias is everywhere. Trust nothing when it comes to the press and specifics. But too much info is being leaked that paints the same picture. Hurts is getting it done. Don't know what that looks like or how the team is responding to him as opposed to the other guys, but given that the press, just like fans has their favorites and prejudices, too many are starting to sing the same song. It's encouraging to know we have at least one difference maker at the position and sooner or later he will get on the field.
 

Similar threads

RTB X Bot
  • Article Article
🏈 David Hill looks at Bama's QB recruiting starting in 2010
    • Like
Replies
0
Views
2K
RTB X Bot
RTB X Bot
Kirk Van de Graaff
  • Article Article
🏈 The Van de Graaff Projected Offensive starters for Bama 2025
    • Like
    • Roll Tide!
2
Replies
30
Views
3K
musso
musso
Kirk Van de Graaff
🏈 The Van de Graaff Projected Defensive starters for Bama 2025
    • Like
2
Replies
31
Views
1K
mando
mando
B
📡 From Alabama's Crimson Tide to Oklahoma's Sooner Magic: The tumultuous journey of Eagles QB Jalen Hurts - Motociclismo
Replies
1
Views
473
RTB X Bot
RTB X Bot
S
📡 Tennessee Football posts practice highlight but blurs out QB who threw INT - On3
Replies
2
Views
826
TerryP
TerryP
Back
Top Bottom