🌎 Government shutdown

[It Takes Eleven]

I didn’t say anything about Warren, she’s obviously very left. So, not sure what she has to do with anything I said.

As for Fetterman is left of Schiff, that very site you show also has Warnock close to center and to the right of Fetterman which is laughable, Fetterman isn’t left of Warnock.

As for not providing examples, you and everybody else has access to Google just as I do.

I think you're talking out of your ass, and when pressed for specifics you spin like a top.

 

[ElephantStomp]

I think you're talking out of your ass, and when pressed for specifics you spin like a top.

And I think you’re an ass, so we have that in common. It’s not my job to provide specifics for you when you’re just as capable of using Google as I am. The very thing you provided shows Fetterman LEFT of Warnock, which is damn laughable, not one democrat would EVER agree with that stupidity. It’s like saying Warren is right of Trump.

 

[TerryP]

You cannot run on certain policies then vote counter to those. He sold people on certain things and has voted against the party numerous times. As I said everybody here has the same access to Google as I do, if they want examples.

If votes on political issues were this important—important enough for you to suggest he's going to be voted out because of his votes—it seems like a logical assumption you'd know what, and where, those votes took place. Otherwise, cursory glance makes the point seem like drama you've been subjected to and further push.

He voted against the budget.
He voted to open the government.
He voted to support Isreal.

There's the first page of Google.

Where's the issue?

 

[TerryP]

To this day I'm still genuinely amazed at how the acronym MAGA is still being tossed around. Let's make our stand against "Make American Great Again."

People. Messaging. There was a different way.

 

[It Takes Eleven]

And I think you’re an ass, so we have that in common. It’s not my job to provide specifics for you when you’re just as capable of using Google as I am. The very thing you provided shows Fetterman LEFT of Warnock, which is damn laughable, not one democrat would EVER agree with that stupidity. It’s like saying Warren is right of Trump.

Where they land varies by measurement criteria, but even progressive measurements show both Warnock and Fetterman as swing voters. There is no measure that places Warnock and Fetterman as distant as Warren from Trump.

In reality, Trump isn't as far right as you'd think. He just does rightward things on the urging of those who flatter him, if he thinks people will praise him for it, or if he can profit from it.

 

[ElephantStomp]

Where they land varies by measurement criteria, but even progressive measurements show both Warnock and Fetterman as swing voters. There is no measure that places Warnock and Fetterman as distant as Warren from Trump.

In reality, Trump isn't as far right as you'd think. He just does rightward things on the urging of those who flatter him, if he thinks people will praise him for it, or if he can profit from it.

True, not as distant, hyperbole. But, Fetterman isn’t left of Warnock in any measure.

He probably isn’t as right as I think, he just moves whichever direction his ego is stroked

 

[Krimson]

Some people think any democrat who didn't go down with the ship on keeping the government shut down until Obama care was funded should lose their spot.

 

[ElephantStomp]

Some people think any democrat who didn't go down with the ship on keeping the government shut down until Obama care was funded should lose their spot.

That it is true and they’re going to. If you decide to fight for something then you stand by that decision, but if you decide to fight then because of a lack of courage you cave and get absolutely nothing what is the point?

 

[Krimson]

That it is true and they’re going to. If you decide to fight for something then you stand by that decision, but if you decide to fight then because of a lack of courage you cave and get absolutely nothing what is the point?

What did the ones who didn't cave accomplish with their stunt? At what point in negotiations do you take the best deal you can get?

I'll keep the government shut down unless you give me what I want..
That's not courage that's pathetic politicians

 

[ElephantStomp]

What did the ones who didn't cave accomplish with their stunt? At what point in negotiations do you take the best deal you can get?

I'll keep the government shut down unless you give me what I want..
That's not courage that's pathetic politicians

They didn’t accomplish anything, that’s the point, because the ones who caved did so for nothing and they didn’t get anything, so really the ones who caved could’ve done so on day one. There were no negotiations, the ones who caved were playing games and that’s it. They said they caved on the assurance that the subsidies would be put to a vote, they’re not going to be put for a vote in any fashion, so again they could’ve caved and went with the republicans on day one instead of playing games.

Whether you agree with the healthcare subsidies or not, the ones that didn’t cave were fighting for those to be permanent, they were at least trying to get something, again doesn’t matter what a person’s opinion is on those subsidies or any other subsidies.

I don’t think anything done in DC by any politician is courageous

 

[Krimson]

They didn’t accomplish anything, that’s the point, because the ones who caved did so for nothing and they didn’t get anything, so really the ones who caved could’ve done so on day one. There were no negotiations, the ones who caved were playing games and that’s it. They said they caved on the assurance that the subsidies would be put to a vote, they’re not going to be put for a vote in any fashion, so again they could’ve caved and went with the republicans on day one instead of playing games.

Whether you agree with the healthcare subsidies or not, the ones that didn’t cave were fighting for those to be permanent, they were at least trying to get something, again doesn’t matter what a person’s opinion is on those subsidies or any other subsidies.

I don’t think anything done in DC by any politician is courageous

They all did it for show. They should'veknown that they weren't going to get what they were asking for, if they didn't know that they are politically inept. The ones who finally caved were sick of holding people hostage when the other side was obviously not going to negotiate with them so they realized their position and took the best way out. You brought up courage, not me.

 

[ElephantStomp]

They all did it for show. They should'veknown that they weren't going to get what they were asking for, if they didn't know that they are politically inept. The ones who finally caved were sick of holding people hostage when the other side was obviously not going to negotiate with them so they realized their position and took the best way out. You brought up courage, not me.

The ones who caved are spineless plain and simple. Their decision to cave had nothing to do with people and all to do with being spineless. Obviously the republicans weren’t going to negotiate, hence why the dems wouldn’t vote for the republican proposal, so the side that caved knew this and still followed the party and decided to cave on a “promise” knowing full well republicans had zero intention of voting for the subsidies. The people that caved are spineless and are lucky that they’re not up for reelection because they would be gone, that’s why people want Schumer out of senate leadership because they’re sure he planned this knowing they couldn’t get primaried. By and large the public backed the dems (according to numerous polls) and they caved.

 

[Krimson]

The ones who caved are spineless plain and simple. Their decision to cave had nothing to do with people and all to do with being spineless. Obviously the republicans weren’t going to negotiate, hence why the dems wouldn’t vote for the republican proposal, so the side that caved knew this and still followed the party and decided to cave on a “promise” knowing full well republicans had zero intention of voting for the subsidies. The people that caved are spineless and are lucky that they’re not up for reelection because they would be gone, that’s why people want Schumer out of senate leadership because they’re sure he planned this knowing they couldn’t get primaried. By and large the public backed the dems (according to numerous polls) and they caved.

As politicians don't you think the democrats should've had a good idea if the Republicans were willing to negotiate over the subsidies before deciding to shut the government down? Imo if they didn't they're brainless which is even worse than being spineless and I would want the ones who decided to shut the government down for 6 weeks with no idea if their plan would have any bearing on the outcome gone. At what point do you believe they should've caved? There had to be an end and one side was going to win, usually the side with the majority accomplishes that. The whole thing was a stunt just like going to other countries to visit deported illegals. The democrats have no platform so they resort to foul language and crazy antics to try to appeal to, well I'm not sure who that appeals to but it must appeal to some.
The problem with the whole government shutdown is there's no repercussions for the morons who decide to do it. The repercussions are on the military, civil servants, etc so it's easy for people to make poorly thought through choices when they have no price to pay.

 

[TerryP]

By and large the public backed the dems (according to numerous polls) and they caved.

IF you make the question about the health care subsidies you'll find the public doesn't want people without. Look back in the thread to Wayne.

HOWEVER, the large majority of the public did not back what came along with those subsidies. Just like USAid, there is A LOT of bullshit in the counter-proposal.

The large majority of the public doesn't feel someone making 10X more per year should get their health care subsidized.

FWIW, it doesn't require a spine to perform a stupid stunt. Spine? Meh. A sliver a common sense? That's what pulls swing voters

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The messaging. It's just like I told you before the election. Hey, last week brought sedition! Here it's "leverage" using hunger.

 

[24and7]