🏈 Bama vs ranked opponents

[DT55FOREVER]

Alabama is 6-5 against last 11 ranked opponents giving up an average of 26.7 points per game.

At some point the coaches have to realize they need to make real changes to their defensive system. We were told by "insiders" that Bama had figured out they needed to make changes to the system to handle the HUNH teams. After three games, they are doing the exact same things they've done for the past several years. The core group of coaches have relied on having the team with the most talent and ability. It's time for a real change.

 

[PhillyGirl]

Meanwhile, let's keep moaning about how awful and trendy HUNH is and how good defense and a lackluster offense will still be enough to win you games and how you don't need a great QB to win games.

:violin:

Seriously, I do wish it was like the old days, but it ain't. Welcome to the new age, Alabama. Adapt or die. Darwin is watching.

 

[DT55FOREVER]

Meanwhile, let's keep moaning about how awful and trendy HUNH is and how good defense and a lackluster offense will still be enough to win you games and how you don't need a great QB to win games.

:violin:

Seriously, I do wish it was like the old days, but it ain't. Welcome to the new age, Alabama. Adapt or die. Darwin is watching.

You got it, Philly.

 

[Crimson&WhiteGecko]

Ahh, no dice. There were 3 big plays against the Defense that scored TD's. One, should've been called back b/c of the penalty. Second, the DB was right there to make the play & didn't. 3rd was complete gross, luck, of which the D was actually creating pressure...the ball didn't bounce our way.

'Bama's defensive scheme was really good until those two plays happened. Please measure the WHOLE body of work. If the defense was as bad as we were implying the score would've been much, much worse.

 

[PhillyGirl]

This is only 1/5th about Ole Miss though. Fact is, we have lost 5 games out of 11 to ranked opponents by an average of nearly 30 points. That's pretty awful. The Ole Miss game was one of the flukiest I've ever seen but what about the other 4 games?

Alabama fans keep complaining about the HUNH, how it's no fair, how it's a flash in the pan .. But we have to deal with it. And the team/staff/etc. haven't shown that they have adequately addressed it or evolved to change with the times.

 

[DT55FOREVER]

Ahh, no dice. There were 3 big plays against the Defense that scored TD's. One, should've been called back b/c of the penalty. Second, the DB was right there to make the play & didn't. 3rd was complete gross, luck, of which the D was actually creating pressure...the ball didn't bounce our way.

'Bama's defensive scheme was really good until those two plays happened. Please measure the WHOLE body of work. If the defense was as bad as we were implying the score would've been much, much worse.

ok. So, we take away the non-penalty touchdown and the fluke ball of the helmet touchdown and they still score 29 points. I know technically we would have won 37-29 but that doesn't mean our defense played well. Also, I'm still waiting for a corner back to find the ball in the air.

 

[Crimson&WhiteGecko]

Philly Girl, don't let your anxiety of the Eagles situation bleed over to 'Bama stuff..

Seriously, though, this was 'Bama's first true test of the HUNH this year. I saw decidedly better D than we've seen before against it. I'll explain below.

DT55, I agree on the corner play. I cannot think for a second they are not being taught to find the ball. They are young & will not be able to play this position without getting burned. Kirkpatrick, Millner, Barron, Clinton-Dix, Jackson,...all had their low points & got better. It takes experience.

However, your points calculation is grossly overlooking several points. CNS stated that 30 points were scored by Ole Miss w/ less than 30 yards of field to work with each time. Doing the math, that's 3 field goals & 3 TD's. The D stopped the HUNH half of the 6 times w/in field goal range. That is improvement, not perfection. And the players were in position to make plays. So the scheme is there (credit K Smart) but the players need more time to work in that scheme to do this flawlessly.

Also, how many drives did Ole Miss have that lead to points where they had over 10 plays to get there?

 

[PhillyGirl]

Philly Girl, don't let your anxiety of the Eagles situation bleed over to 'Bama stuff..

Seriously, though, this was 'Bama's first true test of the HUNH this year. I saw decidedly better D than we've seen before against it. I'll explain below.

DT55, I agree on the corner play. I cannot think for a second they are not being taught to find the ball. They are young & will not be able to play this position without getting burned. Kirkpatrick, Millner, Barron, Clinton-Dix, Jackson,...all had their low points & got better. It takes experience.

However, your points calculation is grossly overlooking several points. CNS stated that 30 points were scored by Ole Miss w/ less than 30 yards of field to work with each time. Doing the math, that's 3 field goals & 3 TD's. The D stopped the HUNH half of the 6 times w/in field goal range. That is improvement, not perfection. And the players were in position to make plays. So the scheme is there (credit K Smart) but the players need more time to work in that scheme to do this flawlessly.

Also, how many drives did Ole Miss have that lead to points where they had over 10 plays to get there?

Hahah trust me, watching the Eagles made the Alabama game seem infinitely better .. even though I did see some similarities ..

 

[DT55FOREVER]

Philly Girl, don't let your anxiety of the Eagles situation bleed over to 'Bama stuff..

Seriously, though, this was 'Bama's first true test of the HUNH this year. I saw decidedly better D than we've seen before against it. I'll explain below.

DT55, I agree on the corner play. I cannot think for a second they are not being taught to find the ball. They are young & will not be able to play this position without getting burned. Kirkpatrick, Millner, Barron, Clinton-Dix, Jackson,...all had their low points & got better. It takes experience.

However, your points calculation is grossly overlooking several points. CNS stated that 30 points were scored by Ole Miss w/ less than 30 yards of field to work with each time. Doing the math, that's 3 field goals & 3 TD's. The D stopped the HUNH half of the 6 times w/in field goal range. That is improvement, not perfection. And the players were in position to make plays. So the scheme is there (credit K Smart) but the players need more time to work in that scheme to do this flawlessly.

Also, how many drives did Ole Miss have that lead to points where they had over 10 plays to get there?

I agree that the DBs need to mature and improve. I just don't feel the defense has changed/improved like they should have considering the talent available and the coaches saying they needed to make changes due to the HUNH. Take away the two possessions OM had at the end of each half to run out the clock and they had 15 possesions in the game. They scored on 8 of them. I know they game was weird with the fluck touchdown off Fitz's helmet and the play that shouldn't have counted with the lineman downfield, but even if you take those two away, they still would have given up 29 points. It was a weird game all around. I just needed to see a real change and improvement in the defense this season and hopefully that will happen against the other teams. I don't know what LA Monroe and Charleston Southern will do, but I believe you will see five more opponents use the HUNH against Bama this season-Georgia, A&M, Tenn, MSU and Auburn.

 

[Crimson&WhiteGecko]

Take away the two possessions OM had at the end of each half to run out the clock and they had 15 possesions in the game. They scored on 8 of them.... they still would have given up 29 points. I don't know what LA Monroe and Charleston Southern will do, but I believe you will see five more opponents use the HUNH against Bama this season-Georgia, A&M, Tenn, MSU and Auburn.

8 scoring possessions, of which 6 possessions inside the 30, of which 3 were field goals that were automatically in field goal range... The Defense made big stops & couldn't keep 9 points off the board, unless they turned it over.

Again, I'll ask the question: How many drives did Ole Miss have that lead to points where they had over 10 plays to get there?

Texas A&M played the HUNH last year and look how we defended that lyear... they are learning. So does MSU...

Georgia doesn't play HUNH. This game falls right into our hands no matter how many running backs they got.

 

[PhillyGirl]

8 scoring possessions, of which 6 possessions inside the 30, of which 3 were field goals that were automatically in field goal range... The Defense made big stops & couldn't keep 9 points off the board, unless they turned it over.

Again, I'll ask the question: How many drives did Ole Miss have that lead to points where they had over 10 plays to get there?

Texas A&M played the HUNH last year and look how we defended that lyear... they are learning. So does MSU...

Georgia doesn't play HUNH. This game falls right into our hands no matter how many running backs they got.

I can't wait for the Georgia game. Back to basics and get out there and WIN! Jawja will face Saban's wrath.

 

[DT55FOREVER]

I'm saying Georgia will use HUNH because of our problems with it. Who cares how many plays it takes to score if you score? When Oregon, Baylor, etc. racks up 40-50 points with drives of 3-5 plays, do you think their opponents defense played well. Yea, BAMA shut out an A&M team that was falling apart at the seams on both sides of the ball but then later gave up 44 to Auburn and 42 to OSU. The defense has been consistent though. Last three teams with good offenses (all of which did use HUNH-OSU did use it in the game) have scored 44, 42 and 43 points.

 

[PhillyGirl]

I'm saying Georgia will use HUNH because of our problems with it. Who cares how many plays it takes to score if you score? When Oregon, Baylor, etc. racks up 40-50 points with drives of 3-5 plays, do you think their opponents defense played well. Yea, BAMA shut out an A&M team that was falling apart at the seams on both sides of the ball but then later gave up 44 to Auburn and 42 to OSU. The defense has been consistent though. Last three teams with good offenses (all of which did use HUNH-OSU did use it in the game) have scored 44, 42 and 43 points.

.. this also makes me worry about our defense. If we can't keep our offense on the field (due to inability to get first downs, turnovers, etc.), and their offense is scoring in speedy drives, the defense is gonna be WIPED early on.

 

[Crimson&WhiteGecko]

O M G....

Nick Saban has made it absolutely clear he isn't satisfied with the performance of times past against the HUNH. This is why he & Kirby Smart went to various other schools this off season to learn more how to defend it better. He has decidedly recruited differently to address this more. I mean, Fitzpatrick is a prime example. True Freshman starting on the Defense.

So we play the first true team this year with HUNH, they literally have zero long, sustaining drives, they get the ball for 6 of the 8 scoring possessions inside the 30, 3 are field goals, & you see zero evidence of improvement at stopping the HUNH. Goal line stands, 4th & 1's etc stopped. Come on, your not letting the weight of this game to actually asses this teams improvement. The past seasons are playing too much of a role on this view. All CNS can do is work to improve it.

I see clear improvement against the HUNH. They didn't stomp them out but I wasn't expecting that. Were you?

 

[Crimson&WhiteGecko]

.. this also makes me worry about our defense. If we can't keep our offense on the field (due to inability to get first downs, turnovers, etc.), and their offense is scoring in speedy drives, the defense is gonna be WIPED early on.

The 5 Turnovers should've have done that to the Defense. I didn't see an ounce of quit in them all game long. This is actually one of the improving tactics that CNS has implemented this year at rotating players in & out during this HUNH.

Have y'all seen that new official that sets the ball? His first job now is setting the ball & being fair at letting teams rotate players when the offense does. This has been handled spectacularly this season w/ the Defense.

 

[TerryP]

This is only 1/5th about Ole Miss though. Fact is, we have lost 5 games out of 11 to ranked opponents by an average of nearly 30 points. That's pretty awful. The Ole Miss game was one of the flukiest I've ever seen but what about the other 4 games?

Don't let arbitrary stats throw you.

The 6-5 number reflects two years where those teams were ranked at the end of the year and it includes these past two games that are currently ranked teams. Two different sets of defining criteria being used.

If you want to made a judgment based on teams ranked at the end of the year, the record stands at 9-5 from 2012-2014.

If you want to make a judgment based on teams that were ranked at the time the game was played Bama was 14-5.

The score differential isn't anywhere close to 30 points, or three points. In the losses it's between 5-7.

How many of the five losses were to HUNH teams? How many of the wins were?

 

[Crimson&WhiteGecko]

Thanks Terry! I was wondering when you'd jump in to this conversation...

 

[DT55FOREVER]

The 5 Turnovers should've have done that to the Defense. I didn't see an ounce of quit in them all game long. This is actually one of the improving tactics that CNS has implemented this year at rotating players in & out during this HUNH.

Have y'all seen that new official that sets the ball? His first job now is setting the ball & being fair at letting teams rotate players when the offense does. This has been handled spectacularly this season w/ the Defense.

It's fine. We will agree to disagree. I just know that they use the exact same defensive system that they have used for the past 7 years. Having talked to two friends of mine that are former Bama players in the NFL, they will tell you that the system is not different. They are both former defensive starters.

I'd like for someone to tell me what specific changes the defense has made from last year other than getting players to lose weight. They still use a 3-4 base defense shifting to a 4-3 by moving up a linebacker. The still have their cornerbacks set up in the same shade as before with the same cushion. To apply pressure on the quarterback, they rely on the same basic blitz packes that they have used forever-a corner blitz with the inside corner on the short side, the corner following the motion receiver to the inside and an inside twist with a linebacker and defensive tackle. It hasn't changed.

 

[DT55FOREVER]

Don't let arbitrary stats throw you.

The 6-5 number reflects two years where those teams were ranked at the end of the year and it includes these past two games that are currently ranked teams. Two different sets of defining criteria being used.

If you want to made a judgment based on teams ranked at the end of the year, the record stands at 9-5 from 2012-2014.

If you want to make a judgment based on teams that were ranked at the time the game was played Bama was 14-5.

The score differential isn't anywhere close to 30 points, or three points. In the losses it's between 5-7.

How many of the five losses were to HUNH teams? How many of the wins were? View attachment 4839 View attachment 4840

Actually, the 6-5 record is based on the ranking at the time of the game and their 5 losses were to Auburn, Oklahoma, Ole Miss (2x) and OSU. All which used the HUNH against Bama.

 

[TerryP]

Actually, the 6-5 record is based on the ranking at the time of the game and their 5 losses were to Auburn, Oklahoma, Ole Miss (2x) and OSU. All which used the HUNH against Bama.

Ole Miss didn't use the HUNH last season. Freeze specifically pointed to it throughout the season to limit mistakes his offense was making. While Auburn does fun a version of a hurry up pace, that's a power running team no matter how you choose to define them. The same with OSU, who used a little hurry up. OU, a little hurry up.

Back to the point, the stats are still arbitrary now that you've redefined them. If you're going to use the Auburn loss in 2013 you have to include the two wins against A&M and Mississippi.

It seems like people have forgotten Bama played a HUNH offense in week two ... of this year.