🏈 Former NFL head coach, June Jones, says Trevor Lawrence is not his favorite QB prospect in the 2021 NFL draft.

[OldPlayer]

If a team has good offensive production which is based solely on QB play—as the run and shoot is—how can one say "not at a high level?" To me, that's a lot like saying Dillon Gabriel isn't a good QB because his team lost four games last season. Do we judge Brodie Croyle on his NFL career? On the 2004 season? On his overall wins and losses? Look, I'm not a big fan of Brodie for a number of reasons but if I used the same criteria on him that wouldn't be a fair shake, right?

If we're talking about NFL-level activity, yes. And yes, we're talking about Mac playing in the NFL. I'm sure June Jones does a good job of finding QBs to play in his system in college. But as for him judging NFL talent, I don't think he's the best evaluator or judge.

Again, I hope Mac goes high in the NFL draft. I hope he lights it up for whatever team picks him. But I don't think June Jones' evaluation of him will sway many teams. Do I think Mac is better than Lawrence? No. I think Trevor Lawrence has some great physical attributes and will bring more to the game (his running ability in addition to his passing). Do I think Mac is a slouch? No. He's a gifted passer with great accuracy. But, he doesn't bring the running ability that Lawrence, Fields or Wilson do.

 

[OldPlayer]

Timmy Chang, who still holds NCAA passing records today, is another example of his QB's. He had that kid nicknamed "Rolo" who threw for eight or nine TD's against BYU. He was a solid guy as well.

Timmy Chang never played in the NFL. If we're talking about NFL talent, Chang is not a good example.

 

[TerryP]

@OldPlayer we're talking about his ability to judge a QB. With his resume with his QB's I don't see it as an opinion that should be doubted based on what happened with the teams he coached and their records.

 

[Elderfalsedemigod]

Lawrence can run. He can run better than Mac. Lawrence ain’t no Lamar. Mac Jones can throw circles around Trevor Lawrence. Mac’s feet ain’t nailed to the ground. He moves very well in the pocket. Trevor Lawrence is a decent QB who benefits greatly from the hype generated by beating Alabama with circus catching WRs and a piss weak ACC schedule

 

[OldPlayer]

@OldPlayer we're talking about his ability to judge a QB. With his resume with his QB's I don't see it as an opinion that should be doubted based on what happened with the teams he coached and their records.

We’re talking about his ability to judge QB talent for the NFL. His coaching success contributes to this. He may be a good judge of talent for his system (Chang, Brennan) but his QBs did not fare well in the NFL. I don’t know his ability to select talent at the NFL level (you never hear about a pro QB that was picked by June), but his opinion on pro QB talent is minimal. That’s why I don’t tout his opinion here. It’s okay for us to agree to disagree.

 

[TerryP]

We’re talking about his ability to judge QB talent for the NFL. His coaching success contributes to this. He may be a good judge of talent for his system (Chang, Brennan) but his QBs did not fare well in the NFL. I don’t know his ability to select talent at the NFL level (you never hear about a pro QB that was picked by June), but his opinion on pro QB talent is minimal. That’s why I don’t tout his opinion here. It’s okay for us to agree to disagree.

It's not that simple. Put your guy, Lawrence, at the Jets and we'll end up seeing a QB put up numbers like Brennan. There is no other professional league that depends so much on a team (and its ingredients) to the point what one might consider "the best prospect" ends up on the trading block in a couple of years. Your reference to Brennan leaves out he was at Washington under Zorn and they couldn't decide on a QB over a stretch of several years. Brennan's success, or lack thereof, is directly attributed to that staff. Campbell, no it's Martel, no it's Beck. That's their QB room over those years.

It's literally boiled down to this. We sit here and discuss draft opportunities often with the caveat, "depends on which team he lands with" but on the other hand dismiss a QB's performance in the league with no regard to which team he landed with. That, to me, makes little sense: moving goal posts seldom do.

But hell, let's set aside June for a second. When it comes to mechanics and pocket feel it's Mac, hands down. That's been proven on the field of play.

Completion percentage, yards per attempt, TD to INT ratio, and QB rating; all of these from last season point to Mac over Trevor. While the NFL drafts on potential, in this case comparing the two isn't based on potential, it's based on what's been seen.

Back to the crux of the matter. Jones says Mac is a better prospect because he has a better deep ball. Is that arguable? No. We saw that on the field against (not using my words here) "weaker competition in the ACC."

You don't care for Jones or his style? That's your opinion. His coaching acumen with quarterbacks and offenses? If you're knocking that, in my opinion, it's more personal feelings. He wouldn't have been coaching in the league of it were a question.

 

[TerryP]

Out of curiosity, I have a question.

Was there any doubt about Jones and his evaluation skills when he was so high on Tua and how he'd do in the league?

 

[OldPlayer]

Back to the crux of the matter. Jones says Mac is a better prospect because he has a better deep ball. Is that arguable? No. We saw that on the field against (not using my words here) "weaker competition in the ACC."

You don't care for Jones or his style? That's your opinion. His coaching acumen with quarterbacks and offenses? If you're knocking that, in my opinion, it's more personal feelings. He wouldn't have been coaching in the league of it were a question.

IMO, Lawrence is the better prospect (not that Mac isn’t a good prospect) because he brings more dimensions (ability to scramble and run the ball) than Mac.

I never said I don’t care for Mac. But at the beginning of the draft when I can pick any player (because I’m the worst team in the league) I would go with Lawrence for his size, experience (started more games and was successful doing it regardless of competition), passing ability (he can throw the ball deep, made many long, intermediate and short throws to lesser WRs), and has the ability to run to get out of trouble (I wouldn’t be looking for a running QB in the NFL - they ain’t running the option). Mac would score lower for size, experience and the ability to get out of trouble. If I’m the worst team, I know my future QB will need to be able to get out of trouble because I have the worst team and an overall poor OL probably contributed to that.

Whoever gets Mac is getting a great QB. And, they’ll get him at a reasonable price since he won’t be first off the block. If I’m the GM, I have to spread a limited amount of money to 53 players - some of them already making more than they should. Burrow was signed for $36 million in 2020 (signing bonus = $23.9, so $12.1 spread over 4 years). The number 10 pick had a total contract of $19.7 million (signing bonus = $11.9). The number 20 pick got $13.3 million (signing bonus = $7.3). Right now many NFL teams are positioning for the draft to build up some players so that another team picks them over a preferred prospect, and are being silent about who they think are value picks.

Mac will be a steal. But if I’m the Jaguars or Jets, I’m going with Lawrence.

 

['65 Cobra]

Bookmark this one along with the others I’ve posted. Mac will be a better pro QB than Sarah Jessica Lawrence or Fields

Mac is a better QB than either of them right now. I didn’t watch the kid from BYU enough to have an opinion so I am not including him

I think he looks a little more like Peggy Bundy.

 

[XXL TideFan]

IMO Lawrence has issues between the ears. He is by no stretch a Johnny Manziel but he does seem to have no bigger fan than himself. I believe Mac to be a better team player with the type of arm and accuracy that many teams want.

Edit: Haha in my own senior moment....I gave Johnny Football the wrong last name. Call me on it

 

[Elderfalsedemigod]

IMO Lawrence has issues between the ears. He is by no stretch a Johnny Mandel but he does seem to have no bigger fan than himself. I believe Mac to be a better team player with the type of arm and accuracy that many teams want.

Agree and I am undefeated in my CFB and NFL record. I did lose 7 games in 5 seasons as a JR Pro coach though (2 of those were forced forfeits because several players were out sick)

 

[XXL TideFan]

Agree and I am undefeated in my CFB and NFL record. I did lose 7 games in 5 seasons as a JR Pro coach though (2 of those were forced forfeits because several players were out sick)

Really don’t get the gist of everything after “agree”. Sounded like a senior moment.

 

[Elderfalsedemigod]

Really don’t get the gist of everything after “agree”. Sounded like a senior moment.

the debate earlier in the thread was whether June’s record in coaching CFB and NFL qualified or disqualified his opinion on Mac Jones. I felt I needed to state my own coaching record so I could also be fairly or unfairly pilloried

 

[rocknthefreeworld]

the debate earlier in the thread was whether June’s record in coaching CFB and NFL qualified or disqualified his opinion on Mac Jones. I felt I needed to state my own coaching record so I could also be fairly or unfairly pilloried

Damn skippy. I have never lost a single game. Can Jones or Saban say that?

 

[ElephantStomp]

@OldPlayer After reading your’s and @TerryP convo I’m curious would you accept Saban’s opinion on the matter?

 

[OldPlayer]

@OldPlayer After reading your’s and @TerryP convo I’m curious would you accept Saban’s opinion on the matter?

More than June Jones. Obviously, Saban has been more involved in getting players into the league and counseling underclassmen to stay or go.

 

[ElephantStomp]

More than June Jones. Obviously, Saban has been more involved in getting players into the league and counseling underclassmen to stay or go.

From a QB standpoint Saban hasn’t been any better than Jones for the most part

 

[mando]

From a QB standpoint Saban hasn’t been any better than Jones for the most part

Not sure I agree with this one. Early on at Bama maybe but he will have 4 in the league soon with 3 possible starters.

 

[JoseyWalesTheOutlaw]

Not sure I agree with this one. Early on at Bama maybe but he will have 4 in the league soon with 3 possible starters.

AJ is The Only NFL QB with 3 NC rings.....Aight

 

[TerryP]

If you're looking for the LSU game it's under Alabama versus Garner Webb on ESPN's app