🏈 Food for thought: Our WR corps is considered deep—but the secondary isn't?

[TerryP]

Just an idle thought comparing the two groups.

Collins is considered the most experienced. Put him next to Amari and it's a wash when comparing the two units.

Jarrick Williams has more starts than DeAndrew White.

Christon Jones had seven starts, appeared in every game last year. Arguably, without injuries hitting, we'd have seen something very similar with Eddie Jackson or Bradley Slyve.

Chris Black played in eight games. Geno Smith 12 (suspended for 1st game last season.)

Maurice Smith played in every game except one. Falkins played in seven.

Yet, one is experienced and has depth but the other doesn't.

 

[alabama mike]

I think, the point TRYING to be made is that we have more game experience at WR than DB. A lot of the DB's played but it was in nickel and dime situations and not at the actual right or left CB spot. The WR played rotated in and out at those specific spots. Of course, I have been wrong MANY times before.

 

[TerryP]

I think, the point TRYING to be made is that we have more game experience at WR than DB. A lot of the DB's played but it was in nickel and dime situations and not at the actual right or left CB spot. The WR played rotated in and out at those specific spots. Of course, I have been wrong MANY times before.

If we're in nickel, that's four defensive backs on the field; in dime five. We subtract Belue so we're looking at three and four, right? We play in nickel over 70% of the time.

We do go to a three WR set. How often?

The scenario you've presented equals more guys seeing action at one time than the other, does it not?

 

[alabama mike]

I have been wrong MANY times before. LOL

 

[bamaraider]

Cyrus to me just doesn't seem like DB is his natural position. He's still learning the position, but just doesn't seem physical enough to jam at the LOS and his foot work isn't the best.

 

[TerryP]

I'm, as usual, hinting around at something that points in a different direction than the narrative we're seeing and hearing. And it's not the secondary.

 

[psychojoe]

Breaking it down a little further, we have considerable experience at safety, not so much at corner. Jarrick Williams and Nick Perry have been around our program for (counting this one) five years, and they both have played a lot of football in between injuries. Landon Collins has seen the field a lot in his two years so far. Gino Smith, not quite as much, but he has still played a good bit of football.

The corners, though undeniably talented, have not seen anywhere near the playing time as the safeties, with varying success and some embarrassment.

On the other side of the ball, the first three guys (Cooper, White and Jones) have played a lot of football for us, in times when games were on the line. The guys behind them have played nowhere near as much. Next year our experience level at the receiver position will be comparable to what it is at the corner position now.

 

[TerryP]

Breaking it down a little further, we have considerable experience at safety, not so much at corner. Jarrick Williams and Nick Perry have been around our program for (counting this one) five years, and they both have played a lot of football in between injuries. Landon Collins has seen the field a lot in his two years so far. Gino Smith, not quite as much, but he has still played a good bit of football.

The corners, though undeniably talented, have not seen anywhere near the playing time as the safeties, with varying success and some embarrassment.

On the other side of the ball, the first three guys (Cooper, White and Jones) have played a lot of football for us, in times when games were on the line. The guys behind them have played nowhere near as much. Next year our experience level at the receiver position will be comparable to what it is at the corner position now.

You're seeing what I'm seeing. The experience factor in the WR corps isn't there to the degree it's portrayed.

Games on the line? We really haven't had a lot of those. And, the breakdowns when we've had those situations haven't been in the secondary, or with the WR corps.

Brings us back to game manager and someone stepping outside of what they could do—OR, what they were prepared to do.

 

[UAgrad93]

I would give the nod on experience to the DBs over our WR corps. With our nickel and dime sets being used "probably 60%" of the time, more of these kids have been on the field in tight situations. On the other hand, Cooper, White and Jones have been on the field the most while the others only step onto the field 6-10 times a game in a 4 WR set. We truly haven't used a 5 WR set, RB has always been the 5th wideout.

 

[JoshB]

I think there is plenty of experience on both sides but I think the difference is that the receivers have had a ton more success than the DBs. Lets be real our corners got toasted a hell of a lot more than Im comfortable with and def. more than Saban is comfortable with last year. Inexperience was the main factor there and I think that year under the fire is going to help several of them ALOT. Plus seeing the addition of two massively talented corners in Humphrey and Brown is likely going to light yet another fire under those guys. I think the success of this unit depends on alot of things and the most being how close to 100% does Eddie get by the opener and how well Marlon and Tony are able to grasp the defense and work their way into PT. If we are able to have a solid rotation of corners with the talent we have that unit could be extremely good. Jackson, Sylve, Jones, Humphrey, and Brown may be the fasted group of corners in the entire country too.

 

[JoshB]

You're seeing what I'm seeing. The experience factor in the WR corps isn't there to the degree it's portrayed.

Games on the line? We really haven't had a lot of those. And, the breakdowns when we've had those situations haven't been in the secondary, or with the WR corps.

Brings us back to game manager and someone stepping outside of what they could do—OR, what they were prepared to do.

Only game we had where the "game was on the line" defensively last year really was Auburn and you could argue Nick Marshall's late TD was a breakdown in the secondary, but I argue that it is the referees not calling a flag when there should have been one but I digress.

 

[TerryP]

I think there is plenty of experience on both sides but I think the difference is that the receivers have had a ton more success than the DBs. Lets be real our corners got toasted a hell of a lot more than Im comfortable with and def. more than Saban is comfortable with last year. Inexperience was the main factor there and I think that year under the fire is going to help several of them ALOT. Plus seeing the addition of two massively talented corners in Humphrey and Brown is likely going to light yet another fire under those guys. I think the success of this unit depends on alot of things and the most being how close to 100% does Eddie get by the opener and how well Marlon and Tony are able to grasp the defense and work their way into PT. If we are able to have a solid rotation of corners with the talent we have that unit could be extremely good. Jackson, Sylve, Jones, Humphrey, and Brown may be the fasted group of corners in the entire country too.

Who had more success versus the other?

Amari vs Landon? Wash.
Christon vs Eddie? Wash.

I do find it interesting you're throwing Marlon and Tony in...no one on the WR corps has anything to point to.

 

[TerryP]

Only game we had where the "game was on the line" defensively last year really was Auburn and you could argue Nick Marshall's late TD was a breakdown in the secondary, but I argue that it is the referees not calling a flag when there should have been one but I digress.

That last TD wasn't really a breakdown in the secondary. Cyrus had that side and he came up to stop Marshall on the run allowing Coates to free up in the flat. Who had containment on the line?

 

[planomateo]

I think there is plenty of experience on both sides but I think the difference is that the receivers have had a ton more success than the DBs. Lets be real our corners got toasted a hell of a lot more than Im comfortable with and def. more than Saban is comfortable with last year. Inexperience was the main factor there and I think that year under the fire is going to help several of them ALOT. Plus seeing the addition of two massively talented corners in Humphrey and Brown is likely going to light yet another fire under those guys. I think the success of this unit depends on alot of things and the most being how close to 100% does Eddie get by the opener and how well Marlon and Tony are able to grasp the defense and work their way into PT. If we are able to have a solid rotation of corners with the talent we have that unit could be extremely good. Jackson, Sylve, Jones, Humphrey, and Brown may be the fasted group of corners in the entire country too.

The fact that Smart is working with the secondary speaks volumes.

 

[JoshB]

The fact that Smart is working with the secondary speaks volumes.

Very true. Glad he is back there tho.

Who had more success versus the other?

Amari vs Landon? Wash.
Christon vs Eddie? Wash.

I do find it interesting you're throwing Marlon and Tony in...no one on the WR corps has anything to point to.

I would point to Cam Sims, maybe even Robert Foster (even tho he is a redshirt) in terms of comparing with Marlon & Tony. And I was more so saying the receiving corps as a whole not man for man comparing the two, had more success.

That last TD wasn't really a breakdown in the secondary. Cyrus had that side and he came up to stop Marshall on the run allowing Coates to free up in the flat. Who had containment on the line?

If I'm not mistaken both Cyrus and HaHa were covering that side and when Marshall ran forward (by the way pretty much half the o-line was 10 yards down field by this point) HaHa sprinted towards him. I dont know if Cyrus did the same.

 

[psychojoe]

I castigated Cyrus for a few days, but eventually I decided it must have Ha Ha late getting over. Whatever, Cyrus was caught with no good choice, although if he had stayed with the receiver Marshall would have had a nice gain rather than a TD.

 

[JoshB]

In both their defense if you were a DB and a running QB looked as if he was taking off, and then you also see offensive linemen sprinting down the field far past the line of scrimmage you would prolly think run all the way too.