šŸˆ Defense needs major fixing

TerryP said:
What did UF have to score to remain in those games?
Click to expand...

So you're saying Florida dialed it back or played down to their competition? They didn't hold back against Arkansas or LSU or Texas A&M or Ole Miss or Georgia offensively and had to score or showed they could score. They lost two games, so I don't see where the argument makes sense here.
 
TerryP said:
What did UF have to score to remain in those games?
Click to expand...
BamaFan334 said:
So you're saying Florida dialed it back or played down to their competition? They didn't hold back against Arkansas or LSU or Texas A&M or Ole Miss or Georgia offensively and had to score or showed they could score. They lost two games, so I don't see where the argument makes sense here.
Click to expand...
He's wondering when the starters left the game.... and what the score was at that point.

In my opinion, you really cannot compare prior games. Too many different sets of criteria that change the outcome.

For me, in the UF game, UF scoring 46 doesn't bother me. Yes, its a high score, but we were playing from a good lead and I think that has some to do with the play calling. We went much more to a running attack to kill clock and UF keyed on that over all else. On top of that, you had a QB and TE making some pretty awesome plays... they all kinda went their way. The TD over PS2 was a bit of a fluke. Maybe the score on that drive anyway, but not as quickly for sure. On the 2nd score of the 2nd half the 3 and 17 conversion isn't something that I would say they complete at a high percentage. The 3rd score of the second half was aided by a 3rd down conversion by penalty and a 3 and 10 conversation to that magical TE of theirs.

I predicted a 52 - 34 score, so it wasn't far off that. A couple of breaks and a few outstanding plays go the other way and lead to a score or two. I don't think an offense with as much talent as UF with as capable of a QB as Trask is going be shut down... now take away that TE of theirs and see what they looked like vs LSU, it's a complete different team. Now, also let's look at the UF average score for the year is 42 points per game... so I don't think it's that unreasonable to think in a must win SEC title game they may score close or above their average... they are a very talented team.

Looking forward, I don't really see ND scoring above 35 points and I don't see us scoring less than 35 points unless the luck of fortune turns against us somehow. Now, Clemson and OSU are two different beast. They will be scoring in the 35 point or more range, so our offense better bring the A game for sure if we make it that far.
 
Last edited:
ColAngus said:
It was Moses' mistake that allowed UF to convert the 3rd and 17 in the 3rd quarter Saturday. He followed that mistake up with a PI on the very next play. UF scored a few plays later to make it 35-31.

Now in his defense, the PI may not have been totally his fault. He was lined up wide, playing man on #6. He didn't have much of a shot there.
Click to expand...

In his defense - He caused the fumble that should have been recovered the play before....
 
Brandon Van de Graaff said:
The middle of the defense, from the nose to the safeties, has been the lesser part of the defense all year. No doubt about that.
Click to expand...

I tend to agree with this... For whatever reason, they stuck with the same personnel (not saying it's not the right call, just saying they've stuck with that line up).

There was so much improvement in between the Fla and Ole Miss games, it's hard for me to blow a gasket with that group. And as said previously, the TO's were there!! Just not capitalized on. Hoping the coverage mistakes were more of an exception to the last 6 weeks or so, and being exposed will help sure things up as it did after Ole Miss.
 
94 Grad said:
He's wondering when the starters left the game.... and what the score was at that point.

In my opinion, you really cannot compare prior games. Too many different sets of criteria that change the outcome.

For me, in the UF game, UF scoring 46 doesn't bother me. Yes, its a high score, but we were playing from a good lead and I think that has some to do with the play calling. We went much more to a running attack to kill clock and UF keyed on that over all else. On top of that, you had a QB and TE making some pretty awesome plays... they all kinda went their way. The TD over PS2 was a bit of a fluke. Maybe the score on that drive anyway, but not as quickly for sure. On the 2nd score of the 2nd half the 3 and 17 conversion isn't something that I would say they complete at a high percentage. The 3rd score of the second half was aided by a 3rd down conversion by penalty and a 3 and 10 conversation to that magical TE of theirs.

I predicted a 52 - 34 score, so it wasn't far off that. A couple of breaks and a few outstanding plays go the other way and lead to a score or two. I don't think an offense with as much talent as UF with as capable of a QB as Trask is going be shut down... now take away that TE of theirs and see what they looked like vs LSU, it's a complete different team. Now, also let's look at the UF average score for the year is 42 points per game... so I don't think it's that unreasonable to think in a must win SEC title game they may score close or above their average... they are a very talented team.

Looking forward, I don't really see ND scoring above 35 points and I don't see us scoring less than 35 points unless the luck of fortune turns against us somehow. Now, Clemson and OSU are two different beast. They will be scoring in the 35 point or more range, so our offense better bring the A game for sure if we make it that far.
Click to expand...

I just looked at the Play By Play of every Florida game this year and Trask played deep into the 4th quarter of every game except Arkansas, unlike Mac whom was out of probably half the games by the 4th quarter.

Don't get me wrong, I love our defense and their ability. I just question why we don't pressure a quarterback that can dissect us like a Trask or Lawrence. I never felt we sent many blitzes his way, and allowed them the one thing they could do to get back into the game. Why not find a way to neutralize the passing game. So what, if they dink and dunk us all over the field and eat up clock? Large chunk plays on 3rd and long is unacceptable at this juncture in the season when you're gunning for a Natty. I don't think it's 100% our coaching, because player's make mistakes, of course, but I can't see a senior like Dylan Moses that we've watched for four years making ten mistakes a game. A sure fire first rounder last year, and all of this after our coordinator said he was simplifying the schemes. Something isn't adding up, and I just don't think it's our players.
 
BamaFan334 said:
Don't get me wrong, I love our defense and their ability. I just question why we don't pressure a quarterback that can dissect us like a Trask or Lawrence. I never felt we sent many blitzes his way, and allowed them the one thing they could do to get back into the game. Why not find a way to neutralize the passing game.
Click to expand...
I think Saban said our game plan was to drop 8 in coverage a lot and try to funnel the WR/TE... but we didn't do a good job executing on a few plans and their players made some outstanding plays also.

I don't know how mobile Trask is, but a lot of time we try to squeeze the pocket and affect the QB instead of sacking to keep him from scrambling. Mobile QB scrambles have killed us in the pass and I think we lean our defense toward cutting down on that against mobile QBs, be that right or wrong. However, this would be in the game prep decision making so we can blame Goldin if you want to; however, it's Saban that signs off on the scheme... so who is to blame is debatable I guess.

In the UF game, I saw many times we blitzed, but they picked it up or hit the hot route slant against it. They seeme to have a good scheme against our blitz so maybe that had something to do with not throwing a ton of blitzes at them.

I don't know... but I do know that Saban does know if the Defense needs an overhaul or not. If it does, he's certainly not going to hold back. He's overhauled the Offense over the last years so he's not "stubborn" in that regard. If he chooses to keep Golden, then he must feel that Golden is the correct guy to give us the best chance at a winning season and program. If he moves him/demotes him... then he doesn't. There is absolutely no way we as fans can have the knowledge to know what the case really is... so I tend to just laugh at post that state "Defense needs major fixing"... cause they can't possible know if it does or doesn't.
 
BamaFan334 said:
I get what you're saying, but that's also a motivational type speak, because how often are you honestly getting eleven guys to all do their job the right way on one play at any level of the sport? I just have a hard time believing we are that weak because of the players in the middle as you stated. Saban would get that one fixed really quick. I haven't dissected play calling and pretty ignorant to the schemes we do run on defense, but we somehow get killed by tight ends and get destroyed on slant routes in every down and long we run it seems. I hate the feeling of having no faith in getting a team 3rd and 17 and stopping them. Vanderbilt, Kentucky, Arkansas, Missouri, sure. But anyone else with more than one target, I worry every single time.
Click to expand...

That's why they grade the game film. I'm not sure you can fix the issues in the middle without either a) recruiting, which they are doing, or b) coaching them up and hoping they get better with experience (good example there is Wright this year). Bama is 1st in the SEC in scoring defense. Played every team but Vandy and South Carolina. 3rd in the league in YPG (behind UGA and A&M, but 2nd only to UGA in YPP, 5.0 to 4.9). That ain't bad. The Ole Miss game was certainly not good, but I just can't get too riled up about the UF game. Saban mentioned multiple times that we were going to have issues covering and dealing with Pitts and Toney. That wasn't a surprise especially when you throw in an elite QB. I totally get that it is frustrating watching teams complete 3rd and long, and giving up so many points. I don't like that things have changed that much over the years, but I also clearly remember folks irritated at Smart years ago and throwing around the phrase "3rd and Kirby" because they'd give up big 3rd and long plays.
 
From Ole Miss to UF our defense got way better than against a damn good UF team the defense doesnā€™t play lights out and all of a sudden we need to change it? I donā€™t see Saban making a change at DC and I donā€™t think he should.

Only team in the playoff that could give us fits is Clemson, they have a generational QB, and great athletes. Ohio St doesnā€™t have the horses, Fields is a good QB, but heā€™s not Trask and damn sure isnā€™t Lawrence. Notre Damn....weā€™ll curb stomp them, Book is a decent QB, but again not Trask or Lawrence.
 
Brandon Van de Graaff said:
That's why they grade the game film. I'm not sure you can fix the issues in the middle without either a) recruiting, which they are doing, or b) coaching them up and hoping they get better with experience (good example there is Wright this year). Bama is 1st in the SEC in scoring defense. Played every team but Vandy and South Carolina. 3rd in the league in YPG (behind UGA and A&M, but 2nd only to UGA in YPP, 5.0 to 4.9). That ain't bad. The Ole Miss game was certainly not good, but I just can't get too riled up about the UF game. Saban mentioned multiple times that we were going to have issues covering and dealing with Pitts and Toney. That wasn't a surprise especially when you throw in an elite QB. I totally get that it is frustrating watching teams complete 3rd and long, and giving up so many points. I don't like that things have changed that much over the years, but I also clearly remember folks irritated at Smart years ago and throwing around the phrase "3rd and Kirby" because they'd give up big 3rd and long plays.
Click to expand...
And Kirbyā€™s defense was having fits with the spread
 
Brandon Van de Graaff said:
But, we have seen Saban change his schemes and the way he recruits in order to adjust to evolving offenses during his time at Bama. In many ways, his evolution on the offensive side has been detrimental to the defense, but it is a worthwhile change.
Click to expand...
CJ is the linebacker that could play in 2009 and 2020.
 
BamaFan334 said:
So you're saying Florida dialed it back or played down to their competition? They didn't hold back against Arkansas or LSU or Texas A&M or Ole Miss or Georgia offensively and had to score or showed they could score. They lost two games, so I don't see where the argument makes sense here.
Click to expand...
HAVE is a key word.
 
My eyes are getting older and not as trained as they need to be watching us play Fl. But, what I often saw against Fl. and against other teams in past games this season and others, is when we get them into 3'rd an long, (passing down), when we bring pressure, it seems like almost every time we drop into zone and watch the QB. Their receivers run to open grass, turn around and there is the ball, usually on target and usually for a first down.
In my opinion, if you are going to try to pressure the QB with extra rushers or stunting with your DL, then you should man up and pressure their receivers also. Get in their face on the LOS, make them change their route. Guard your man, not the QB eyes.
 
Brandon Van de Graaff said:
That's why they grade the game film. I'm not sure you can fix the issues in the middle without either a) recruiting, which they are doing, or b) coaching them up and hoping they get better with experience (good example there is Wright this year). Bama is 1st in the SEC in scoring defense. Played every team but Vandy and South Carolina. 3rd in the league in YPG (behind UGA and A&M, but 2nd only to UGA in YPP, 5.0 to 4.9). That ain't bad. The Ole Miss game was certainly not good, but I just can't get too riled up about the UF game. Saban mentioned multiple times that we were going to have issues covering and dealing with Pitts and Toney. That wasn't a surprise especially when you throw in an elite QB. I totally get that it is frustrating watching teams complete 3rd and long, and giving up so many points. I don't like that things have changed that much over the years, but I also clearly remember folks irritated at Smart years ago and throwing around the phrase "3rd and Kirby" because they'd give up big 3rd and long plays.
Click to expand...

I happen to agree with you on funneling the quarterback inside to close the outside lanes to them. Makes complete sense and I actually like it as our nose is usually better than the center and can close that gap and therefor cause trouble. As far as having the correct guys in the middle at linebacker, we have already started creating a more lean athlete that can run and that started with the likes of Reuben Foster under Cochran. You could easily see the transformation from his Junior year to Senior year. Moses is the perfect size athlete for what we run. My concern is we are on the wrong end of too many mismatches, and that should not happen when we have two shut down corners and some VERY solid Freshmen playing Star. No other team out there has a #4 and #5 that should keep us mismatched. I also do not understand the whole "we knew we were gonna have problems matching up" from coach because deep down he knows their offense and should have had our guys ready. He has no way of knowing what plays will be ran, but making sure we aren't in a Harris vs Cook matchup like against Georgia should be at the forefront of his planning. The middle of our defense drops into zone and we just have major gaps and large patches of green that a one star player could settle in and make a catch. I wonder if we have our safeties way too deep? I trust our corners more times than not, so I'm not as worried about the safeties moving up to help the backers and our corners being one on one over the top. I understand giving up 17 points is asking way too much against a top offense, but giving up 46 is not my idea of a good night either. Like someone said earlier, I'll definitely take a one point victory any day over a loss, but I do not accept that it's the players not performing. We have the horses, I just question who is getting them in the correct spots.
 
Just like we do with #6 the other teams move their WR's and RB's around to get mismatches. Guess what, there are not very many 6-4/6-5 Safeties so their TE will be a mismatch against anyone. Pitts did not play against LSU or likely would have put UF over the hump in that game. In the middle with our Safeties and 13 they are freshman so they are still developing and learning how to respond to what they are seeing. Experience allows you to react faster. Also physically you grow and get stronger and faster and your technique improves. These guys are going to get better.

I have complained about the D big time this year after OM so when it is all said and done I am not happy with the D giving up 46 points and never will be. The D has improved on some fundamentals that were a major problem early. We are where we are at this point and will have to outscore opponents that have dynamic offenses.

It should not be ND that creates the biggest issues for our D in the CFP, but I also do not believe in taking any team for granted as you guys know. Clemson or OSU should be the bigger challenge for our D but the ND QB is a gritty playmaker.

If the loss of Dickerson creates and issue or one of he teams with the dynamic offense figures out how to slow us down we will be in trouble.
 

Similar threads

Max
šŸˆ Predictions for the player of the year from each conference
Replies
0
Views
629
Max
Max
G
šŸˆ UA/Ark press conference transcript with Saban
Replies
1
Views
987
TerryP
TerryP
Back
Top Bottom