| FTBL Trickle Down Economics and Pigskin Prognostication Week 7

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Ole Miss at Alabama

Lets get one thing out of the way right now for the sake of our visiting Ole Miss friends...we have already paid the refs. There is little need for you to even show up, the SEC office has their check in hand. The Alabama boosters had to take out a loan (they were broke, since we paid all of our recruits and our coaches are the highest paid in the nation by far), in order to underwrite the SEC officials of Alabama benevolence fund. Whether we beat Mississippi 7 to 6, or 47 to 6, the refs were to blame, so we acknowledge that now so that you don’t have to bellyache about it later.

In all seriousness, it looks like Ole Miss has supplanted Southern Miss as the team that bellyaches about officiating - it must be a Mississippi thing. It does not matter how many videos exist showing Arkansas using twelve players while catching ricochets off the turf, or an LSU defensive back shoving an Alabama receiver to the turf in order to make an interception in the end zone, Alabama is obviously benefitting from officiating. We must ignore the fact that in Mike Shula’s last season, Mississippi was penalized less than Alabama. Ditto for 2005. In 2004, Alabama was 11th in the SEC in opponent penalties...Alabama’s opponents were rarely flagged. In 2003 Alabama was middle of the SEC in penalties and opponent’s penalties. In Dennis Franchione’s last season (2002), Alabama was the MOST penalized team in the SEC; someone must had forgotten to mail the check the the SEC office.

illegaltouching.jpg

Yes, the Mississippi player touched it first.

The reality for Ole Miss fans is this: sorry, the refs don’t own you, Alabama does. Alabama is 45-8-2 against Ole Miss (44-9-2 if you count the forfeit of 93). Alabama has outscored Mississippi by almost 1,000 points in those 56 games, that is a lot of yellow hankies worth.

Here is a quick question for you...what former Mississippi coach holds the highest winning percentage during the first five years of his tenure? If you said “David Cutcliffe,” you would be correct! Any team who would willingly trade David Cutcliff for Ed Orgeron, has no right to complain about refs. They have no right to complain about ANYTHING. Trading Cutcliffe for Orgeron and complaining about officiating costing you a game is like shooting yourself in the face with rock salt and complaining that your ice cream isn’t freezing fast enough. You traded a coach who beat Alabama, Auburn, and Florida in the same season, for a coach who couldn’t speak a coherent sentence. When you do that, you have officially forfeited any right to complain about officials.

...but Duke thanks you.

Looking ahead to the 2008 game between Mississippi and Alabama, a number of things do stand out. All joking aside, Ole Miss is one of the most penalized teams in the league, and Alabama is second among least penalized teams; nothing to do with officials being paid off, everything to do with disciplined play. Houston Nutt instills his players with a hard nosed style of play, but Arkansas was routinely among the most penalized teams in the league during the latter part of his tenure in Fayetteville. This lack of disciplined play appears to have followed him to Oxford.

Much has been written about Ole Miss being one of the most physical teams Alabama will play this season, and possibly the most aggressive team defensively. While that sounds good, Mississippi ranks 11th in the SEC in scoring and total defense categories, and perhaps most disturbing (from their perspective) is their 9th ranked rushing defense. While the Rebel defense has had success against spread offenses, they have been less effective against power running. Ole Miss held Florida to 124 rushing yards, but Florida employs a spread attack. Wake Forest had just 81 yards rushing in an offense predicated on misdirection and spread formations. Alabama will not employ those tactics, they will line up and smack Ole Miss in the mouth. Mississippi defensive tackles are around the 300 pound mark, but the ends are undersized. Look for Bama runningbacks to have a lot of opportunity for cut backs splitting the ends.

At the same time, ball control passing attacks like employed by South Carolina, have wreaked havoc on the Mississippi secondary. Ole Miss is dead last in the league in pass defense, having given up an average of almost 229 yards per game. At the same time, they are dead last in passing efficiency defense, allowing a 65.5% completion percentage, and a league leading 9 TD’s on the season. The Rebels have given up over 300 yards through the air on two occasions this season, and with the defense having to focus on Alabama’s running game, Ole Miss may make John Parker Wilson look like Joe Namath. With cornerbacks standing in a 5’9 and 5’10, and safeties at 5’11, Julio Jones (6’4”), Earl Alexander (6’5”), and tight end Nick Walker (6’5”) have to be salivating.

Offensively, Ole Miss does cause some concern. Alabama’s defense has been most vulnerable to a short passing game, and Mississippi is well equipped to utilize such an attack. Alabama will shut down the Mississippi running game, making Mississippi throw the ball. Jevan Snead is third in the SEC in passing, with 212 yards per game and 9 TD’s, of concern for the rebels is Snead’s propensity for throwing to the wrong color jersey’s, as he has matched his TD’s with interceptions.

In the trickle down category, Ole Miss is an interesting study. The Rebels have seldom been a force in recruiting, yet they had some degree of success in the first seasons of the charismatic Orgeron - finishing 29th nationally in 2005, and 15th in 2006 (according to Scout). In 2007 Orgeron’s welcome was wearing thin, and the recruiting rank dropped to 31st, and Nutt’s first class was down at 38. Other than a few recruits per class, the bulk of the Ole Miss recruiting classes were not offered by Alabama. In fact, a careful examination of the 2008 class finds that Ole Miss beat out Memphis, Southern Miss, and UAB for many of their signees. Ole Miss relies on trickle down talent and project players, to be competitive in the SEC. Prior to the upset of Florida, Mississippi’s last SEC victory was in the Egg bowl in 2006 - one of only two SEC wins on the season, which was one more than the single win over an SEC school in 2005.

Final things.
Ole Miss is a football program with an identity crisis. They have great tradition in terms of gameday experience vis-á-vis “the grove.” What they don’t have is great winning tradition. Mississippi fans get angry when faced with this reality: they are Ole Miss. That means if they can win more than they lose, it is a good year. Cutcliff’s 10 win season of 2003 gave the Mississippians an overinflated sense of self-import, and after the 4 win season of 2004 they made the horrific decision to fire him. Nutt is a solid coach, but it is unlikely he will perform any better at Ole Miss than Cutcliffe. Arkansas is in a far better situation from a recruiting standpoint, and Nutt still managed an occasional losing season. Unlike Mississippi, Arkansas did not jump the gun and fire him, and he had very successful seasons in years following. While Nutt may take Ole Miss to a 9 or 10 win season, how will the Rebel fans and administration respond when the inevitable 4 win season comes? If Cutcliffe is any indication, not well. Ole Miss fans must realize, they are Ole Miss, and the process of becoming “Not Ole Miss” will take many years. Duplicating Wake Forest’s success in the SEC is not realistic because if Wake Forest was in the SEC, they would be duplicating the success of Ole Miss.

All kidding aside, Nutt is a vast improvement over Orgeron, but Ole Miss is still Ole Miss.

Bottom Line.

Alabama will stop the run, and run successfully. The undersized Mississippi secondary will be victimized by the McElwain controlled passing game, and Alabama will rack up significant yardage. There is a pattern involving Alabama v/s Ole Miss games played in Tuscaloosa.

Here are the Tuscaloosa games since 1996:

2006 - Alabama 26 - Mississippi 23
2004 - Alabama 28 - Mississippi 7
2002 - Alabama 42 - Mississippi 7
2000 - Alabama 45 - Mississippi 7
1998 - Alabama 20 - Mississippi 17
1996 - Alabama 37 - Mississippi 0

The 2006 game in Shula’s final season is the anomaly. Most Ole Miss games played in T-Town result in blowouts, regardless of the coach or talent fielded. Four different Bama coaches blew out Ole Miss in 12 years.

Jevan Snead will move the Rebel offense and score some points, but it will not be enough to stop the Tide at home.

Alabama 38 - Ole Miss 17
 
bear facts said:
Not only Duke, but Tennessee thanked Ole Miss as well.

Btw, you wouldn't happen to know CHN's all-time coaching record in BDS?

Some good stuff as usual, B_F. ;tr

Nutt is 1-4 in T-town.
 
Bama 28 - OM 20

Nutt always plays Saban close.

Ark 30 - UK 24

Petrino is getting the Hogs better

UGA 44 - VU 14

Vandy heads downward

USC 34 - LSU 27

The Saban Effect is about gone

UT 17 - MSU 13

Two lackluster Offenses
 
BAMAPERRY said:
Bama 28 - OM 20

Nutt always plays Saban close.

Ark 30 - UK 24

Petrino is getting the Hogs better

UGA 44 - VU 14

Vandy heads downward

USC 34 - LSU 27

The Saban Effect is about gone

UT 17 - MSU 13

Two lackluster Offenses

That's a bigger than usual day for UT.
 
Here's my predictions:

BAMA 30 - OLE MISS 17

LSU 31 - SOCAR 13 (THEY ARE SOCAR, NOT USC. THEY ARE NEVER TO BE CONFUSED WITH THE REAL USC)

KENTUCKY 28 - ARKANSAS 20

GEORGIA 34 - VANDY 10

TENNESSEE 20 - MISS. STATE 6
 
BAMAPERRY said:
Bama 28 - OM 20

Nutt always plays Saban close.

I don't know...I don't consider 55-24 or 43-14 particularly close. He is 2-3 against Saban, and 2 of the 3 were blowout losses. The wins were by 11 and by 3 (OT iirc). His two wins were both home games in little rock during the streak where Arkansas always won there.
 
FWIW, Nutt's record vs Saban

2000- 14-3 W (LR)
2001- 38-41 L
2002- 21-20 W (LR)
2003- 24-55 L
2004- 14-43 L (LR)

Arkansas beat us 28-21 in '00 and we won in '02, 30-12.
 
TerryP said:
FWIW, Nutt's record vs Saban

2000- 14-3 W (LR)
2001- 38-41 L
2002- 21-20 W (LR)
2003- 24-55 L
2004- 14-43 L (LR)

Arkansas beat us 28-21 in '00 and we won in '02, 30-12.

Yeah, we beat them @ Arkansas in 2002, but it was in Fayettenam, not Little Rock. Arkansas is always tough in LR.
 
Big_Fan said:
TerryP said:
FWIW, Nutt's record vs Saban

2000- 14-3 W (LR)
2001- 38-41 L
2002- 21-20 W (LR)
2003- 24-55 L
2004- 14-43 L (LR)

Arkansas beat us 28-21 in '00 and we won in '02, 30-12.

Yeah, we beat them @ Arkansas in 2002, but it was in Fayettenam, not Little Rock. Arkansas is always tough in LR.

You got me to looking when you mentioned this...

Surprisingly to me, they don't play a lot of their SEC games in LR. A few, here and there, mostly against LSU (7)and MSU (5) and South Carolina (4). UT and OM (2x, lost all 4) AU, VU, UK each have 1.

Their record, even though it's winning the majority of the time, isn't spectacular. (.610 against SEC opponents) In fact, it almost mirrors their overall record vs SEC opponents since '92.

FWIW, we've only played Arkansas twice in LR and haven't lost. ('96 and '92)
 
TerryP said:
Big_Fan said:
TerryP said:
FWIW, Nutt's record vs Saban

2000- 14-3 W (LR)
2001- 38-41 L
2002- 21-20 W (LR)
2003- 24-55 L
2004- 14-43 L (LR)

Arkansas beat us 28-21 in '00 and we won in '02, 30-12.

Yeah, we beat them @ Arkansas in 2002, but it was in Fayettenam, not Little Rock. Arkansas is always tough in LR.

You got me to looking when you mentioned this...

Surprisingly to me, they don't play a lot of their SEC games in LR. A few, here and there, mostly against LSU (7)and MSU (5) and South Carolina (4). UT and OM (2x, lost all 4) AU, VU, UK each have 1.

Their record, even though it's winning the majority of the time, isn't spectacular. (.610 against SEC opponents) In fact, it almost mirrors their overall record vs SEC opponents since '92.

FWIW, we've only played Arkansas twice in LR and haven't lost. ('96 and '92)

That may be the overall percentage, but they went through a period where they didn't lose in Little Rock. The numbers probably averaged out otherwise. I just remember Little Rock being a stronghold for them.
 
Big_Fan said:
That may be the overall percentage, but they went through a period where they didn't lose in Little Rock. The numbers probably averaged out otherwise. I just remember Little Rock being a stronghold for them.

Yeah, I remember. It was DuBose through Shula's first year. 18 (?) W's in a row in LR.

Arkansas still uses, most of the time, that Little Rock venue to play the "lesser teams," IE: your North Texas type games.

In that winning streak, only a few decent teams came through there. The best one, record and SEC wise, was the '99 Mississippi State team who finished with a 10 win season that year.

If you recall, when they started that streak they were facing teams like S. Car. during the beginning of their 0-fer streak...teams like LSU who were struggling to maintain .500 records, etc.

A different subject...but LR to Arkansas is about like B-ham to Bama...Arkansas needs to just stop playing games there. They make a heck of a lot more $$ with games in Fayetteville.
 
Re: Trickle Down Economics and Pigskin Prognostication Week

Big_Fan said:
Ole Miss at Alabama




Much has been written about Ole Miss being one of the most physical teams Alabama will play this season, and possibly the most aggressive team defensively. While that sounds good, Mississippi ranks 11th in the SEC in scoring and total defense categories, and perhaps most disturbing (from their perspective) is their 9th ranked rushing defense. While the Rebel defense has had success against spread offenses, they have been less effective against power running. Ole Miss held Florida to 124 rushing yards, but Florida employs a spread attack. Wake Forest had just 81 yards rushing in an offense predicated on misdirection and spread formations. Alabama will not employ those tactics, they will line up and smack Ole Miss in the mouth. Mississippi defensive tackles are around the 300 pound mark, but the ends are undersized. Look for Bama runningbacks to have a lot of opportunity for cut backs splitting the ends.

At the same time, ball control passing attacks like employed by South Carolina, have wreaked havoc on the Mississippi secondary. Ole Miss is dead last in the league in pass defense, having given up an average of almost 229 yards per game. At the same time, they are dead last in passing efficiency defense, allowing a 65.5% completion percentage, and a league leading 9 TD’s on the season. The Rebels have given up over 300 yards through the air on two occasions this season, and with the defense having to focus on Alabama’s running game, Ole Miss may make John Parker Wilson look like Joe Namath. With cornerbacks standing in a 5’9 and 5’10, and safeties at 5’11, Julio Jones (6’4”), Earl Alexander (6’5”), and tight end Nick Walker (6’5”) have to be salivating.

I sure hope Coach Saban can avoid Coach Zook's results against a terrible pass defending team in Ole Miss.

Quotes after the Ole Miss game 10/4/03

"Just because their stats aren't very good against the pass doesn't mean they're not going to practice and get better."

"We've got a long way to go, but we're close. I know that sounds like I'm contradicting myself."

“Hindsight is 20-20.” (Explaining why the Gators rushed 35 times against the nation's worst pass defense. On the October 9 Gator Hotline radio show that followed the Ole Miss loss, someone explained to Zook that deciding to pass against a terrible pass defense is foresight, not hindsight.)

"You don't change offenses midstream. We're going to do what we've been doing. That's not going to change."

“We wanted to establish the run. We felt like we had to run.” (Against the worst pass defense in college football)

It is not a good sign when your coach is asked about turnovers, and he has to pass on answering because he can't remember which interception was which. (Miami Herald)

:D
 
Re: Trickle Down Economics and Pigskin Prognostication Week

bear facts said:
Big_Fan said:
Ole Miss at Alabama




Much has been written about Ole Miss being one of the most physical teams Alabama will play this season, and possibly the most aggressive team defensively. While that sounds good, Mississippi ranks 11th in the SEC in scoring and total defense categories, and perhaps most disturbing (from their perspective) is their 9th ranked rushing defense. While the Rebel defense has had success against spread offenses, they have been less effective against power running. Ole Miss held Florida to 124 rushing yards, but Florida employs a spread attack. Wake Forest had just 81 yards rushing in an offense predicated on misdirection and spread formations. Alabama will not employ those tactics, they will line up and smack Ole Miss in the mouth. Mississippi defensive tackles are around the 300 pound mark, but the ends are undersized. Look for Bama runningbacks to have a lot of opportunity for cut backs splitting the ends.

At the same time, ball control passing attacks like employed by South Carolina, have wreaked havoc on the Mississippi secondary. Ole Miss is dead last in the league in pass defense, having given up an average of almost 229 yards per game. At the same time, they are dead last in passing efficiency defense, allowing a 65.5% completion percentage, and a league leading 9 TD’s on the season. The Rebels have given up over 300 yards through the air on two occasions this season, and with the defense having to focus on Alabama’s running game, Ole Miss may make John Parker Wilson look like Joe Namath. With cornerbacks standing in a 5’9 and 5’10, and safeties at 5’11, Julio Jones (6’4”), Earl Alexander (6’5”), and tight end Nick Walker (6’5”) have to be salivating.

I sure hope Coach Saban can avoid Coach Zook's results against a terrible pass defending team in Ole Miss.

Quotes after the Ole Miss game 10/4/03

"Just because their stats aren't very good against the pass doesn't mean they're not going to practice and get better."

"We've got a long way to go, but we're close. I know that sounds like I'm contradicting myself."

“Hindsight is 20-20.” (Explaining why the Gators rushed 35 times against the nation's worst pass defense. On the October 9 Gator Hotline radio show that followed the Ole Miss loss, someone explained to Zook that deciding to pass against a terrible pass defense is foresight, not hindsight.)

"You don't change offenses midstream. We're going to do what we've been doing. That's not going to change."

“We wanted to establish the run. We felt like we had to run.” (Against the worst pass defense in college football)

It is not a good sign when your coach is asked about turnovers, and he has to pass on answering because he can't remember which interception was which. (Miami Herald)

:D

UF had 3 INT's that day...remember that weekend well. (mostly that Sunday trying to figure out why Shula threw Brodie back into the Georgia game)

I understand what you are driving at here factor.

However, drawing a comparison with this Ole Miss team and the '03 version led by Manning is a bit of a stretch. UF, even though the score didn't reflect it (20-17,) got whipped that day by the Rebels. Hell of a ball game...OM with @ 500 offensive yards split pretty evenly between rushing and passing.

All that said, a missed FG in the very beginning of the 2nd half would have sent this game to OT for UF...but, didn't happen.

(this game was on a college football classics last week :D )
 
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